1) Does brain size actually increase? How is this possible when it's surrounded by the skull?

LOL, are you serious? No.

Teaching dogs things teaches them how to learn. The same is true in humans. The first time I used a clicker, my dog looked at me like I had lost my mind. Now she picks up tricks lickety split because she knows what that click means. I've taught the dog how to learn.

No, dogs can't run out of memory the way a computer does. Neither can humans. If you practice everything you've taught previously, your dog shouldn't forget anything, no matter how many new tricks you teach - at least until he becomes senile.

 

LOL, are you serious? No.

I've actually read that, though.

It sounded totally like WTF to me, too, but instead of just trusting my reaction (I probably would have had the same WTF reaction to "clicker training" too - a sound telling a dog exactly what they did right sounds funny until you actually use it)

Actually, I've read stuff that supposedly increases brain size in humans.

The one thing that seems most likely is that we (and dogs) get new paths that connect all the neurons and stuff in the brain.

I'm trying to find that site again (maybe it was taken down lol) that said that. I did find this:

Did you know that when you become an expert in a specific domain, the areas in your brain that deal with this type of skill will grow?

For instance, London taxi drivers have a larger hippocampus (in the posterior region) than London bus drivers (Maguire, Woollett, & Spiers, 2006)…. Why is that? It is because this region of the hippocampus is specialized in acquiring and using complex spatial information in order to navigate efficiently. Taxi drivers have to navigate around London whereas bus drivers follow a limited set of routes.

http://www.sharpbrains.com/blog/2008/02/26/brain-plasticity-how-learning-changes-your-brain/

Granted, it's in humans, but perhaps the principle is the same or similar in dogs.


Learning to learn is what I suspected to be true. Probably is where "creativity" comes in (like when Wally tries a known behavior in a new situation or using it in the face of solving a new problem) as well.

Good to know I can't overload Wally's brain with knowledge Didn't seem likely, but, again, if you don't know and can't really test it - ask.

 

Think of it this way, what you are saying is that if we teach a dog things it will alter its genetics (making it's brain grow in size). That's physically impossible.

The average human brain weights 8 pounds give or take a few ounces each way. That weight has no bearing on how much that human learned, or didn't learn. It's pure genetics.

I have no studies to confirm, but I would assume each breed of dog has an average brain weight. So if a likke Pap learned 1,000 tricks he wouldn't have this enourmous great dane skull. See how funny that sounds?

Remember, just because you read it doesn't make it true. Common sense wins out on this one.

Also, I am constantly teaching my dog new things. It just keeps them active and interested. They are not like a computer and have a finite amount of hard drive space that you can use up.

 

I have no studies to confirm, but I would assume each breed of dog has an average brain weight. So if a likke Pap learned 1,000 tricks he wouldn't have this enourmous great dane skull. See how funny that sounds?

I can't find anything either, but it seems certain they'd be different.

And...yeah, that does sound funny LOL - though that result would be SCARY looking

Now - that said, perhaps size could be measured in number of cells that make up the brain. (Though, I guess "quantity" would be a better descriptor). If that pap learned 1000 tricks, would he have more brain cells than a pap that didn't get much in the way of training - say just the basics of sit, stay, and down?

Remember, just because you read it doesn't make it true. Common sense wins out on this one.

Right, which is why I asked instead of just posting it was true

Though, how does this explain that quote where studies showed the different size of a part of the brain related to their spatial skills (the cab drivers had a larger hippocampus)? Did they just happen across people who just had different sizes due to other factors (genetics, randomness, etc)


Here's another question (to anyone - not related to the "limited brain space" thing):

Do you believe that dog dreaming (or dreaming in general) is a way to process information during sleep? Do you think dogs always dream or only when we see them moving their paws in their sleep and such.

Again, something I read (and I can actually FIND this one LOL: http://www.petplace.com/dogs/do-dogs-dream/page1.aspx)

That gives some mention to this being a possible (even probable) purpose of dog dreaming.

 

I think about the hippocampus thing in the cab drivers this is an example of the hippocampus being "larger" in the sense of neuronal connections as compared to the other parts of the brain in a NON cab driver...so the overall brain size/weight doesn't change, but the density of neuronal connections varies from different parts of the brain that are used more often or "exercised".

If you are interested in this sort of thing you should get a copy of "The Brain that Changes Itself" by Dr. Norman Doidge. It's about brain plasticity in humans but the information in it is certainly applicable to other mammalian brains. It's really well written and has some interesting stories in it.

 

I will have to look for that book. Thanks for the lead.

And thanks everyone for the info and putting up with my stupid dog questions

 

There was a French civil servant who was of low-normal intelligence but an MRI showed almost no brain matter at all, just a thin outside portion.
Reuters with pictures

It seems like dog training is like humans doing crossword puzzles and brain teasers. Many studies have shown that keeping an active brain helps ward off dementia as people age. The brain has an amazing capability to rewire itself, that is how children who have had half their brain removed for severe seizure treatment can regain almost normal physical function (and apparently completely normal mental function). Stroke victims can sometimes "re-wire" the brain around the damaged area.

In humans, a suggestion for burning those new neural pathways has been to vary routine-- brush your teeth with the opposite hand, drive a different way to/from work, change the furniture arrangement at home so you have to move around differently.