I can't agree.. I've heard too many people call adorable paps "rats".. but I think people have biases against all breeds.. you know.. "_____ are dumb/cold blooded killers/stinky/slobbery/ankle biters"...

 

Rats? .__. I think they are kinda cute...
Though wouldn't compare the two. xD

 

Yea i really don't see the resemblance either LOL

 

Being toy dogs they will be seen negatively by some people. It happens and you have to be used to it. It is very annoying to those that know the breed and know the breed as the smart, capable little dog it is. Though they are a totally different breed and a completely different type of dog than a chihuahua, they will most likely be compared to chihuahuas. Most people cannot tell the difference. My dogs have been called useless, girly, wimps, rats, fu-fu, ankle biters, you name it. They have been asked 'Yo quiero taco bell'. I've been told who knows how many times that so and so's pit bull could eat my dog in one bite. On any outing I usually run into at least one jerk that thinks making fun of my dogs is funny.

Going to dog shows and even that stock show I went to today and yesterday is refreshing. Most animal people it seems have heard of the breed and have heard that they're 'smart' so they ask about all that. I was so happy getting nice comments about the girls for once this weekend.

Of course I would love for them to be seen that way by everyone because I think they deserve it, but they won't be. A lot of people (even 'dog lovers') will say mean things because of their size. I just enjoy them anyways and strive to prove them wrong.

 

I've only ever heard good things about paps, excluding people that can't tell a pap from a chi from a hole in the ground. They are brilliant little dogs with a real go get-em approach to life. The only pap I've ever disliked was my friend's dog "Beasley", and that's only cause he's a bossy little head case. As a person who currently owns medium-large ish dogs, I've got to admire having all the cute of a dog in a small, portable package!

(Though I am jealous of all the small dog owners ability to take their dogs everywhere, at least where I live. Stores will allow tiny dogs because they're
"less likely to cause damage and be a threat". If any of these people ever saw a Chi or a Pom having a hissy fit, I think they'd say different...)

 

Stores will allow tiny dogs because they're "less likely to cause damage and be a threat". If any of these people ever saw a Chi or a Pom having a hissy fit, I think they'd say different...)

I think the business owners would probably rather deal with the dogs' hissy fits, than the ones the owners would throw if they were not allowed to bring their dogs inside.

 

I think they are cute dogs. There is one Frankie at the dog park I go to and he is very aggresive with the bigger dogs. After speaking with the owner the dog is home a good bit....so in regards to the way a gots behaives has a good deal to do with their environment.

I have 2 pomeranians that are not the sterio typical yappers and snappers and I honestly pride myself on how hard I worked with them with sounds, passer bys etc. They LOVE other dogs and people (the one is a bit stand offish then the other which is my social butterfly)

To be honest I see a good bit of papillons from where I live.

 

Papillons are popular amonst a group of my friends, so I personally know/have known 9 already. Overall I like the temperament of the breed and do think that they get more of a break - reputation wise - than some other small breeds.

Amongst the nine I know, there were/are three that I found to be neurologically quirky with very OCD type behaviour - two were siblings, though, from an grandfather/granddaughter pairing. Their coat also leaves something to be desired (for me) as I tend to like a short or medium coat, but I guess those who like papillons would probably desire the full long coat.

I like best the oversize ones but that is because I live rurally. When out here and on a walk the smaller Papillons just can't keep up (they usually give it a good shot though) to my 15-20 pound mutts when going across country (which is most often where I walk) - the grass is often taller than they are.

I know the Tibetan Spaniel is in the miscellaneous class and not toy, but I believe it is another breed that is fairly untainted in regards to temperament - could be wrong as they are too rare here for many to know about.

I have 2 pomeranians that are not the sterio typical yappers and snappers and I honestly pride myself on how hard I worked with them with sounds, passer bys etc. They LOVE other dogs and people (the one is a bit stand offish then the other which is my social butterfly)

To be honest I see a good bit of papillons from where I live.

I thought that since Pomeranions and Papillons have been mentioned on this thread, and I happen to be a canine history fan, that this little tidbit might be interesting for some.

"In Belgium, Papillons such as Mme. Delville`s Mignonne, captured by the photograph reproduced below, were infused with Melitæus blood lines (i.e., Toy Spitz aka Pomeranian) to develop the erect ear variety depicted in the early photograph of Mme. Delville`s Cybille, also reproduced below."

"The cross breeding of drop-ear Papillons with Pomeranians created the erect ear variety of the butterfly dog. This was the desired result, and to the delight of enthusiasts, the erect ear proved to be dominant. The genetic experiment had its pitfalls however, such as the straight Spitz rear so obvious in the tintype. It also introduced the Pomeranian`s undercoat, solid colors, liver or self-color pigmentation, and small, high set ears. Desirable characteristics for Pomeranians but undesirable for Papillons. To overcome these characteristics, the earliest European and English standards, precursors of our current standard, incorporated various prohibitions that are present to this day in the AKC approved standard for the breed. They are generally presented as "faults" and "disqualifications". The prohibitions were, and still are, couched in such severe terms to protect the breed. They comprise most of the parts of the official standard which characterize the breed and must be considered by anyone judging the breed."

http://metroareapaps.org/content/view/14/28/

The above linked page has some wonderful historical photos on it as well!

 

Hate to burst your bubble, but Paps are already quite a common puppymill dog.

My neighbors (NOT next-door, fenceline neighbors....a block or so away) had a horrid oversized Pap named Rudy who they let run loose, who would run up and down my fenceline barking at my dogs until I'd bring them in. If I left my dogs out, he'd do it for hours or until my guys got too tired to run and bark. Ugh, I hated that dog. Fortunately for me, he "disappeared" one day when there was a carnival at the park....I suspect someone stole him. I hope they're good to him. He's the only Pap I've known personally, though I see a lot of them around. I'm sure they're nice little guys when they're responsibly kept, I won't let Rudy taint my opinion of them .

If I ever get a little dog, it'll be a Pap or a Miniature Poodle.

 

had a horrid oversized Pap

Hey, there's nothing wrong with over-sized paps Lol!


In my experience, there are always people who will dislike a dog just because it's a small dog. I always show people at school pictures of Basil on my phone, and several times I'll hear people say "Ew, I'd never have a small dog. I don't like small dogs. I've got a {insert large breed here}" etc. etc. Most people don't know what a Papillon is, but generally the people who DO know what it is have a much less biased opinion about small dogs. And even though there are a few grumps out there that don't know what they're missing, the vast majority of the public seems to be simply enamored with Basil once they meet him XD We went to a pet store once and the manager kept saying "Wow, that is such a cool dog!" and the other day I was walking through the park with Basil when a really nice elderly couple stopped and started petting Basil and complimenting on how pretty he was

 

In the Uk you see very few paps, Ive only ever seen 2 and they both belonged to the same person. My vet commented on the fact they rarely get them in but they do seem to be getting more popular. Mine is lovely but rubbish with other dogs, shes very nervous in general but I dont think she has the typical temperament.

I think paps and poms are quite similar, mine has a really fluffy puppy coat and a lot of people think shes a pom (which are more popular where I live) or a Chihuahua.

The only Tibetan terrier I know is very dog aggressive but only with certain ones. Apart form that hes lovely.

 

The only Tibetan terrier I know is very dog aggressive but only with certain ones. Apart form that hes lovely.

Good to know about that particular Tibetan Terrier. Have you ever known a Tibetan Spaniel?

I've never met a Tibetan Terrier myself, but do know two Tibetan Spaniels and do really enjoy meet ups with them.

 

Truly the pomeranian thing is purely speculation. I've heard so many different versions of how the erect ears came to be. Truth is no one is likely to ever know. Common stories are of random mutation (there is a painting or two of erect eared dogs before the suspected cross). It's also commonly attributed to either a few poms being added or a chihuahua being added.

 

I am a "dog person" and, although I knew that they existed, I really didn't know much about paps at all before joining this forum. I am happy to say that through hearing stories and seeing pictures of paps on here, I have grown quite fond of the little butterflies and would definitely consider owning one if presented with the opportunity. Thank you to all the pap owners on here for educating me and showing me what fun little dogs you have!

 

I confess to not being a fan of tiny dogs in general or anything that strikes me as a frou-frou, girly dog. But then I do own a cocker spaniel and I've heard people say that of cockers. I don't care for the show look cockers though with the long, long fur. That's another thread though.

 

Frou frou and girly? It's a good thing they don't know they're supposed to be frou frou.

 

LOL Laurelin at the Papillon doing laundry!

And yeah, Hulk, I guess someone must have forgotten to tell Basil that he's supposed to be frou frou and girly! He reminds me more of a little spaniel than a daintly little toy with bows in his hair. He's all about adventure, and he's not afraid to get his paws a little muddy! Especially if he sees a squirrel!

It's sorta difficult to get good walk pictures, isn't it? Lol! I need to get some pictures with his new backpack! He looks like a little hiker dog! =D

 

LOL Laurelin at the Papillon doing laundry!

Yeah, I still haven't figured out how to train that one yet. It'd be so incredibly helpful though. Hear that dogs? *hint hint*

 

I agree, I wish someone would tell Gizmo he supposed to be frou-frou. Especially since he can out-run and out-jump most of the bigger dogs..and he's been known to put a few in their place ie) 110 lb american bulldog rolling over and submitting to him. He's the only dog at our park that can keep up with the greyhounds.. Not only that, but he can jump a four foot fence. (the parks fence is 6 feet, but the fence that seperates the small dog and big dog park is for, and he has cleared it a few times, most of the time he just pushes over it with his paws.) Nothing frou frou about him..


And btw, Paps have been in a family movie. Just a not too famous one, considering it was a cast of nobodies... Bracelet of Bordeaux...we just rented it and watched it for the sake of the Pap.

 

That reminds me, back at my old dog park, there was a lady there that would talk to me about Papillons, and she would say they all seemed to be very assertive around other dogs! Just as she was saying this, Basil was standing proudly over a large Doberman that was submitting to him XD

Also, I've seen paps in another movie, that Adam Sandler movie called "Click." I think that's what it's called at least. It's the movie where he gets a remote that controls actual time. In the movie they have a pap named Peanut that they got as a replacement for their Golden Retriever.

 

I have a 10 pound Jack-Chia girl and she stood up to a GSD that got loose on our street when I was walking her. She stood right up to him and stood her ground!

I picked her up and went the other way. The GSD accidentally got loose from his yard.

 

Let's not forget that Christina Aguilera owns a pair of Paps as well. And although she is one of the very very few pop 'princesses' that I respect, I am happy that no one has really blown up her breed of choice..and turned Paps into celeb accessories..

 

You know who else owns papillons? Ron Jeremy.... I kid you not.

 

Ron Jeremy! LMAO. That is fantastic!! I think I love them that much more, now.