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Re: You still wana by a pup?

I can't believe I just watched that whole thing. That just sucks!!!
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

I suggest you re-phrase that buy from a resposible breeder or adopt from an animal shelter/rescue.Here we go with the PETA films.I will try to bite my tounge right now.....
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

I appreciate wanting to educate people against the evils of puppy mills. I think that they are awful as well.

I just wish that great breeders would be pushed as much as rescues are. Great breeders, as well as rescues, work to reduce the dog over population. Plus, shelter dogs aren't right for every situation.

I personally don't care which way people go, as long as what they do is responsible. Great breeders are no more responsible for puppy mills then rescues are.

Sometimes, its easy to forget that.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

Yes of course I do. A poor breeding facility or mass breeding facility....I'm missing the point, it has what to do with me wanting to buy (not by) a puppy? Do I want to buy from a pet shop or one of those type of breeders - of course not. If I did that I might as well walk into the shelter and try my luck or a random dog off the street. So to answer your questions, yes I do want to buy a pup though I most certainly rather take one that a breeder is offers me without charge instead of buy but I have and will go either way.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

I appreciate wanting to educate people against the evils of puppy mills. I think that they are awful as well.

I just wish that great breeders would be pushed as much as rescues are. Great breeders, as well as rescues, work to reduce the dog over population. Plus, shelter dogs aren't right for every situation.

I personally don't care which way people go, as long as what they do is responsible. Great breeders are no more responsible for puppy mills then rescues are.

Sometimes, its easy to forget that.

Agreed with this :) I don't support BYBers or puppy mills at all, but there is nothing wrong with getting a pup from a responsible breeder (or a rescue!).
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

Nothing wrong with buying from a responsible breeder (one who shows/works their dogs, does proper health testing, has goals for their breeding ect KNOWS what their doing) verses a back yard breeder (who just breeds becuase, mixes 2 breeds together to create a mutt with a fancy name, no goals.) or a puppy mill. there is a WORLD of a difference between a good breeder and a BYB and puppy mill.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

Saw the video and many others like it.

Worked/volunteered in rescue and shelters for a handful of years. Still occasionally do rescue if I can. Have an 8yo mutt from the pound.

Will NEVER "adopt" a dog in lieu of purchasing one from a breeder. If breeders were outlawed tomorrow and I had to choose between a rescue/pound dog or none at all, I'd probably be dog-less for the rest of my life. I value work ethic in a dog, good temperament that must be BRED for, health that must be BRED in, critical socilization periods that, once closed cannot be made up for. A poorly bred or undersocialized dog can be a dangerous thing. Said 8yo mutt is what convinced me to NEVER get a dog from this outlet again. I've been a dog person since the day I was born and have always respected, never feared dogs until we got this mongrel :( We were not average dog people, we knew what we were doing, trained/socialized this dog from the get-go. I got this dog to overcome a heap of baggage regardless that he was only 5 months when we got him. He has an unpredictable temperament meaning one set of events will not trigger aggression 9 times, then the 10th time, it will - out of the blue with no warning growls. He will overreact, instead of growling or nipping at us or one of the dogs for doing something they always did around him, he will respond with a full blown attack. I have been trying to convince my mother to have him PTS.

As a breeder I hear from many people in my community about their dogs. I hear from puppy people looking at breeders. If I had a dollar for every time I heard "we are normally committed dog people but we got a dog from *insert shelter here* and we had to take it back, it was so aggro. We had in home trainers, spent thousands, but the dog just had a bad temperament. We took it back to the no kill shelter where it is now awating adoption from another family." So show me as many bad breeders as you want. There are rotten apples in every bunch but that doesn't mean that there are still good breeders out there. I have said one of my best dogs came from a USDA kennel and I would take my chances going back to that breeder than getting a GSD from rescue. I got news for you, the purebred rescue dogs are coming from places like the one shown above as the breeders could care less where the dogs end up. They are not well bred dogs that somehow got tangled in rescue.

More power to anyone who prefers to go through a rescue! They have every right to get a dog from any place of their choosing. This is a free country. So on the flip side of that coin, if someone wants to purchase a dog from a breeder, frankly, it's none of your business.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

I agree with UB completely.

But... I am on the rescue side... why? Because I one of those people that can and want to deal with it NOW. It's not easy and IT IS NOT FOR EVERYONE AT ALL!

UB covered so many great points... a rescue dog can come with so much baggage that the avg. dog owner cannot handle and DOES NOT KNOW HOW TO HANDLE. So when a first time dog owner comes to me and asks for advice... I more often than not... suggest a Reputable Breeder first. If I feel this owner has potential to take on a rescue... then I will suggest a shelter.

But it is everyone's OWN choice to pick a puppy or dog from a Reputable Breeder or a Rescue.

I'm going to say something that might come as a shock to alot of people on here... because everyone knows me as having a big heart and loving my rescue work... but, I am in the process of getting to know a Reputable Breeder that I will hopefully get my FIRST sound, and wonderfully bred Great Dane from (she's wonderful and I'm going to travel to meet her in June at a Specialty Dane Show). I've never had reputably bred dogs before... all have been rescues.

I am on the fence as to HOW I'm going to feel after I see how WONDERFUL a sound and great specimen of the breed is. How amazingly different it will be. I honestly do not know if I will ever want to take in a rescue again. We'll see... but that is how HUGE the difference is.

To each his own... but even though I'm deeply in love with my rescue work at the moment... A RESCUE DOG IS NOT FOR EVERYONE.
Nessa

ETA: Another thing is health risks, genetic problems and such. I had many people including someone on here question my choice on Rescuing 2 Great Dane puppies that were rescued from BYBs. Two Great Danes that were not health checked... not bred for temperament, soundness... personality... just for money. I Agreed at the time... it was a HUGE risk taking in 2, and still is... because anything can pop up at any time. They are still only a year... alot of things dont show until after 2 years... so I might be in for it... I might not. But I knew the risks... I knew the money that might have to be involved... and I still wanted to do it. I have the means to pay for anything that might arise... and I am ready for it. As it is... I get them X-Rayed every 6 months to watch for HD and Knee problems. (It does take some money)
Alot of people do not know all the things that can happen... and are in shock when it does.
So just something else for people to think about.
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Oh also wanted to add that, that vid is a small part of the documentary "Earthlings" Phew I watched that a couple of weeks ago and it was pretty harsh, very very very harsh... just to warn anyone in case they find out where the vid came from and want to watch the whole documentary.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

Saw the video and many others like it.

Worked/volunteered in rescue and shelters for a handful of years. Still occasionally do rescue if I can. Have an 8yo mutt from the pound.

Will NEVER "adopt" a dog in lieu of purchasing one from a breeder. If breeders were outlawed tomorrow and I had to choose between a rescue/pound dog or none at all, I'd probably be dog-less for the rest of my life. I value work ethic in a dog, good temperament that must be BRED for, health that must be BRED in, critical socilization periods that, once closed cannot be made up for. A poorly bred or undersocialized dog can be a dangerous thing. Said 8yo mutt is what convinced me to NEVER get a dog from this outlet again. I've been a dog person since the day I was born and have always respected, never feared dogs until we got this mongrel :( We were not average dog people, we knew what we were doing, trained/socialized this dog from the get-go. I got this dog to overcome a heap of baggage regardless that he was only 5 months when we got him. He has an unpredictable temperament meaning one set of events will not trigger aggression 9 times, then the 10th time, it will - out of the blue with no warning growls. He will overreact, instead of growling or nipping at us or one of the dogs for doing something they always did around him, he will respond with a full blown attack. I have been trying to convince my mother to have him PTS.

As a breeder I hear from many people in my community about their dogs. I hear from puppy people looking at breeders. If I had a dollar for every time I heard "we are normally committed dog people but we got a dog from *insert shelter here* and we had to take it back, it was so aggro. We had in home trainers, spent thousands, but the dog just had a bad temperament. We took it back to the no kill shelter where it is now awating adoption from another family." So show me as many bad breeders as you want. There are rotten apples in every bunch but that doesn't mean that there are still good breeders out there. I have said one of my best dogs came from a USDA kennel and I would take my chances going back to that breeder than getting a GSD from rescue. I got news for you, the purebred rescue dogs are coming from places like the one shown above as the breeders could care less where the dogs end up. They are not well bred dogs that somehow got tangled in rescue.

More power to anyone who prefers to go through a rescue! They have every right to get a dog from any place of their choosing. This is a free country. So on the flip side of that coin, if someone wants to purchase a dog from a breeder, frankly, it's none of your business.
I'm just the opposite, I've never bought a pure bred dog. Always mutts nobody wanted, but usually puppies. I'd put many of them up against any purebred for working ability and temperament. When someone offers you a grand for your adopted mutt, it says something.

My current dog I got from a rescue shelter, a 3yr old abused purebred GSD from a backyard puppy mill, she was the breeder. She'll be the most challenging yet because she did miss a lot. She's obviously not the best specimen of the breed but she'll also undoubtedly be a fine dog in a couple of years. She'll have good home regardless though, I don't just say I'm committed, I actually am.

I have no problem with people buying from a breeder at all if that's what you want. I don't have really that big an big issue with pet store puppies either.

But you can get some fine animals from a shelter or rescue. It may not be for everyone, and getting an adult dog is probably best left for experienced dog people, but I see little difference for the average owner between well bred and mutt. Most people will raise even the best bred pups and reinforce bad behavior into them anyway.

The real problem I have is irresponsible people making all the mutts instead of responsibly keeping their animals from breeding.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

To Nessa and Urban Beagles-

I guess that's why I don't get why so many people on this forum try to push rescue dogs as the be all end all answer to any post where the person wants a dog.

I can't count the number of times where I've seen, "Oh, get an older dog. You'll know what you're getting then!"

Really, you DON'T know what you're getting. You have no idea what's happened to that dog, why its in the shelter, what hidden problems it will have, what kind of health issues you will have...

Again, I'm not trying to down rescue. I just wish that people would be more responsible in pushing rescue on this forum. There are two edges to the sword.

I know that the breed specific dog lovers on here will answer breed questions honestly and harshly critize the breed-

Oh, too much shedding for most normal buyers!
Needs lots of exercise!
Prone to hip displasia and heart problems!

I dont' see a whole lot posts regarding rescue dogs starting out, "Well, you can feel good about saving a life, but here is what you may have to deal with..."

I just think that people should be educated on both sides of the coin. There are difficulties with getting from a breeder and problems with rescuing. Nothing is perfect and people have to make good decisions for themselves.

What's important is that people get what they want so tha the dog will stay in a home as long as possible. That in the end will reduce dogs in shelters.

As for my personal rescue story, I had no idea that dogs could have as many issues as my boyfriend's rescue. I grew up around show dogs with rock solid temperments and few health issues.

When I met his dog, she cowered behind him and acted like I was going to eat her alive.

I didn't know how to react. I'd never had a dog react to me in that way before, and I had grown up with dogs. It took this dog 5 months to warm up to me, and even now she can't bring herself to play if Im' the one initiating the game.

My boyfriend loves this dog with every fiber of his being. So, I try to help out as I can, despite being in school. But, she'll never be "normal" and while he loves her, that frustrates him as well.

So, just know what you're getting into. That's all.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

[sarcasm]I was one of them "average dog owners" when I rescued Elsa, and I'll NEVER rescue again.


I mean seriously why would I do it again after one bad experience with Elsa?


This dog was a mess and too much work for an average dog owner like me.


So I have no idea why anyone would choose to rescue over a "reputable" breeder. It makes no sense whatsoever.

[/sarcasm]
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

On the flip side though, you can get a dog from a good breeder with NO baggage and end up with a mess. I have one, and his good pedigree and good upbringing didn't prevent him from being an unstable dog. All my dogs from 'questionable' backgrounds were a lot more stable and 'normal' than him.

I'm not saying everyone should rescue (I have 5 purebreds from breeders right now) but sometimes people act like all rescue dogs have a million problems and all breeder dogs are problem free.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

Ok that last part had nothing to do with puppy mills or breeding or even shelters... seems to me it was just some extremely cruel and demented people. That makes me sick to my stomach.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

[sarcasm]I was one of them "average dog owners" when I rescued Elsa, and I'll NEVER rescue again.
I mean seriously why would I do it again after one bad experience with Elsa?


Ummm. Yeah, wasn't Elsa a retired dog from a breeder?
Breeder dogs aren't rescues. I know some people think when I retire a dog they are doing rescue, but they're not.
 

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Re: You still wana by a pup?

Judging by the first photo, CP got Elsa from there as a little puppy, not even capable of being a breeder yet. >o_O< I could be wrong.
 

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Do I still want to buy a puppy? Yes, from a responsible breeder, sure. I am a HUGE advocate of shelter babies, but breeders have their place too.

I am however, NOT a PETA fan. I do think they educate the public, yes, but if you look into their background, I think they take things too far. No kill shelters are amazing in idea, but sometimes the only humane thing to do is put a dog to rest instead of having it's life spent in a cell.

This video brings tears to my eyes mostly because of the treatment of the feral animals. Not all animals are strays! Strays are abandoned. A lot of these animals LIVE outside on the streets and that is their home! We have to respect that. Just like a lot of other animals, domesticated animals can have their homes on the streets. For some, they are happier there then they will ever be in a home or in a cage.
Mind you, I spend a lot of my time addressing the public about feral cat colonies. There is no reason for anyone to ever dump their animal on the streets. But the ones who are there already, the ones who are truely feral, deserve to stay where they are, where they are happy.

|I volunteer in Southern Ontario to help with the over population of cats (dogs are actually not as popular here, but once I move to the Philippines, that is my goal to do there). These cats are part of program where they are caught, altered, and are given worming treatments. They are feral animals and are happy on the streets. They are not housepets and we need to respect that of them. Under no circumstances do I ever think people should put their animals on the streets. Part of our program is to help lessen the population of these animals. I'd just like to clarify that before someone jumps down my throat. :) haha|
 

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I'll be honest, Curb, I don't think that's fair.

You got your dog as a puppy. You were able to shape her as you chose. My post was for adult dogs specifically.

I have no experience with rescue puppies and cannot comment on them.

AND, many rescues to have problems. People should be educated as to what they're buying. If you don't agree, that's fine. You don't have to. I just think there are two sides to the rescue coin.

BTW- Your dog is cute, Curb. Puppymill or not, she looks like she turned out well. :)
 
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