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The Service Dog Thread

74K views 121 replies 43 participants last post by  Bentwings 
#1 ·
This thread is being created as a source of information for those who do not understand the basic ins and outs of the legal rights of service dog handlers.

I am not usually so presumptuous, but I would really appreciate it if this thread could be made into a sticky. We go 'round and 'round on service dog issues on this forum with relative frequency, and it's tiring to type it out over and over again.

First up, the difference between an emotional support animal and a service dog.

An emotional support animal is just like it sounds. It offers emotional support to its handler. These animals are exempt from "no pets" rules in rental housing and are allowed to fly on planes. While SOME states may grant them public access in every day stores, most do not, and the handler can legally be asked to remove their dog from the store.

A service dog is a dog trained in specific tasks that mitigate the disability of its handler. The ADA was recently amended, and the only animals legally allowed to be assistance animals are dogs and, in some cases, miniature horses (they have a separate provision).

A handler with a trained service dog has public access rights into ANY area the public is normally allowed (planes, trains, and automobiles, shops, movie theaters, etc).

In the United States of America, there is no registering body for service dogs. Because of this, "official paperwork" may not be required by anybody to "prove" a dog is a service dog. It doesn't exist. Though some service dog organizations may print out paperwork for clients that graduate from their school, all the paper means is that the dog was obtained from and trained by that organization. There is also no requirement in the United States that service dogs must be identified in any way, so dogs are allowed to go into stores and work "naked" (collar and leash must be used, of course).

For the record, I'm personally not interested in arguing on this thread, I'm just giving information. Some people feel it should be required for dogs to be identified and registered, yadda yadda yadda. All I'm here to tell you right now is that legally neither of the aforementioned things are required.

Next up, "safe guards" for shop owners and the like.

Things store owners are allowed to ask a service dog handler:
Is that a service dog?
What tasks does the dog perform to mitigate your disability? (and variations thereof)

Proper responses from a handler:
Yes
(Using my animal as an example) My dog assists me by pulling me in a wheel chair, acting as a brace, and picks up objects that I have dropped or cannot reach.

PLEASE NOTE that "My dog keeps me from being anxious" is not an acceptable response. A dog simply being present to keep somebody from being anxious is not a trained task, and thus the dog does not qualify as a service dog.

What a store owner may NOT ask/do:
What is your disability?
May I see your dog's paperwork proving it is a service dog?
Your dog is not identified as a service dog, so you'll need to remove the dog until it is identified.

Proper responses from a handler:
I'm sorry, but it is illegal for you to ask me that question. It is a violation of my privacy and you do not need to know the nature of my disability.

There is no registering body of service dogs in this country, and it is not legal for you to require to see paperwork for me to gain access with my service dog.

There is no legal requirement in this country stating that service dogs must be identified in any manner. You cannot require me to identify my dog.

There are certain cases in which a service dog may legally be excluded from being in attendance, such as in sterile environments like an operating room. The dog may not be excluded from the lobby/waiting room, because those are places the general public is allowed, but it may not go anywhere where it may introduce pathogens that could be harmful to patients (another such example is the ICU).

If a service dog is acting up in public (eliminates on the floor, is causing a disturbance, or is being a threat to other patrons), the handler may be asked to remove the dog, but the handler must be allowed to return, sans dog. That said, the dog cannot be barred from a place of business permanently based on what it did the LAST time it was present. The dog can only be judged at the time it is in attendance.

Link to the ADA section about service dogs:
http://www.ada.gov/service_animals_2010.htm

FAQ for SDs in places of busines:
http://www.ada.gov/qasrvc.htm

And now, spectator etiquette!

When you see a service dog:
1. Do just that...SEE the service dog. Do not talk to it, do not try to pet it, do not bother the dog. The dog is there to work, not for your amusement.

2. If you see someone with a service dog and you MUST say something, acknowledge the HANDLER, not the dog, and please continue to follow rule #1. Do not say "What a beautiful dog!" and then immediately bend over to get in the dog's face, and proceed to tell it how beautiful and helpful it is. First of all, it's extremely rude, and secondly, while all service dogs should be able to handle ANYTHING, some dogs will take this as a threat, and you could get bitten. If you wouldn't do it with a strange dog you saw on the street, you shouldn't do it to the working dog!

3. Don't automatically assume a handler is blind.

4. To go along with #3, don't assume the handler is blind, and then tell your child it is ok to pet the dog, because the handler won't be able to see. I can't tell you how other handlers will react, but I will verbally eviscerate you, because that is NOT COOL!

5. Do not accuse a person of not having a real service dog because they are not blind. Not all disabilities are visible.

6. Admire, but do not gawk. It is not polite to stare, and that extends to staring at the dog. This includes doing things like pointing out the dog to your child (unless you plan on educating the child). So incredibly rude and obnoxious.

7. Do not get mad when a handler does what they need to do to protect their partner. If this includes yelling at you or your child, so be it. I personally try to be very diplomatic, and give people a chance to back off...but if you're going to stalk me around the store and get in my way while I'm shopping, you are not going to be met with a happy person.

8. To go with #7, respect the space of the handler and the dog. This doesn't mean we expect people to move out of our way or significantly alter how they are shopping. All it means is that we would appreciate it if you would LOOK where you're walking. If the handler says "excuse me", please give them some room to pass. You would do the same for a person without a service dog, wouldn't you?

9. You don't have to like it that the dog is in the store, but as long as the dog is a legitimate working animal, there's nothing you can do about it. Being nasty won't help anybody. Just tolerate the dog, do what you gotta do in the store, and be on your way, like any other day.

10. Do not scream when you see the dog. The dog is there to work, and really couldn't give two craps about you. They will walk by you as if you don't even exist. They will not (should not) bite you or otherwise bother you. As far as they're concerned, you're little more than a utility pole in the middle of the aisle.

11. It does not matter where you see the dog or what the dog is doing. It doesn't matter if the dog is in a static position (sitting, standing, or laying on the floor). The dog is working at ALL TIMES. The dog is not taking a break. The dog is doing as the handler requested, and is holding that position for a REASON. Do not distract the dog from its task. Interfering with a working service dog is an illegal offense!

12. Control and EDUCATE your children! Explain to them that they cannot run up to strange dogs (this is a good rule of thumb anyway), and explain WHY they cannot run up to strange dogs. If your child gets away from you to go after the dog anyway, PLEASE be sure to APOLOGIZE to the handler! Also explain to the child that the dog is a "helper/working dog". Do not tell them what kind of work the dog does, because you don't know.

Not all service dog handlers are blind. Telling the child every time you see a service dog that the handler is blind, or is only a helping trainer teaching the dog to help the blind becomes a perpetual string of misinformation. That child will pass it along to another, and another, and another, and eventually, one of them will likely accuse a handler that ISN'T blind of being a fake.

13. Reiterating rule #1!!!! My dog is medical equipment. Please do not talk to my dog. You wouldn't talk to a wheelchair, you shouldn't talk to my dog.

Talking to my dog also includes extending praise to my dog. You have no right to praise my dog or give my dog commands. Why? Because aside from the fact that he is WORKING, he is MY dog, not YOUR dog.

I understand that you're trying to be kind, but what you're really being is RUDE! It is also much, much easier for my dog to ignore someone touching them (I will reiterate that you need to not touch my dog either), but it's pretty doggone hard to ignore somebody that's in your face, and there comes a realistic point where I can no longer be mad at the dog for responding to his environment.

Admire all you want. Ask me questions if you feel comfortable doing so. But do not. Talk. To my dog.
 
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#2 ·
Thank you so much for this Xeph! My son had a SD a few years ago and we got asked all the time by store and restaurant managers to show papers from his doctor and papers proving Stryke had graduated special training and wasn't just a family dog that we stuck a vest on. I just kept them in my purse all the time. I never knew that they couldn't demand to see them. I was scared to go anywhere without them. I guess had I done the research that I should have done I would've known that. Now, I feel like I spent those years being a complete idiot frantic about those papers (I made copies for every family member that might have my son and his dog out and about). LOL
 
#3 ·
This thread is being created as a source of information for those who do not understand the basic ins and outs of the legal rights of service dog handlers.

I am not usually so presumptuous, but I would really appreciate it if this thread could be made into a sticky. We go 'round and 'round on service dog issues on this forum with relative frequency, and it's tiring to type it out over and over again.
Your wish is my command. And I agree, with the frequency this subject comes up, an informational sticky is a VERY good idea. Thanks for taking the time to type this up, Xeph.
 
#6 ·
I have a question... this is something that came up in conversation yesterday with my boyfriend's family regarding service dogs (as they raise leader dogs)...

And I'm honestly not sure at all how to look at/handle this situation, but it applies to me.

As most people here know, I work at a very large, private dog park. We have an office where visitors must first come through, sign up/pay, and their dogs must pass vaccination and temperament test screening with other dogs prior to entering the 25-acre park. We also have a ban on bully breeds.

SO, what should we do if a Pit Bull comes in as a service dog with handler (these situations all assuming there is another dog with that fits all the requirements for our park & wants to visit..), an unvaccinated service dog, or (the worst problem..) a DOG AGGRESSIVE service dog... Obviously letting any of these service dogs into our park could put our members in danger and strictly goes against what our policies are.

Where could we drawn the line, if anywhere, what would we say, what legal bearing do we and the handler's each have? I feel like I cannot legally tell a handler their dog can't visit as they may sue, but I cannot let a dangerous dog into the park, either. I feel like the chances of this ever happening are slim, but what if they do? I would hope anyone thinking of doing this could just respect our policies and not try to push the issue, but if they did...

I brought it up to my boss and she was going to consult her attorney about it. I figured I'd ask others with a service dog how they would expect or know (per the laws I'm not as familiar with) it to be handled. Thanks in advance!
 
#7 ·
to my knowledge, a service dog is legally allowed to be asked to leave if it is putting other members/people of the establishment in danger. I'll try to find the exact law, but for example if bubba began growling and barking at a patron, we could legally both be asked to leave (and i would be able to return sans bubba).

i imagine this would apply to the dog park as well.

edit: found it!

http://www.ada.gov/archive/animal.htm

Q: What if a service animal barks or growls at other people, or otherwise acts out of control?

A: You may exclude any animal, including a service animal, from your facility when that animal's behavior poses a direct threat to the health or safety of others. For example, any service animal that displays vicious behavior towards other guests or customers may be excluded. You may not make assumptions, however, about how a particular animal is likely to behave based on your past experience with other animals. Each situation must be considered individually.

Although a public accommodation may exclude any service animal that is out of control, it should give the individual with a disability who uses the service animal the option of continuing to enjoy its goods and services without having the service animal on the premises.
 
#11 ·
It is my understanding that you can only exclude a service animal when their presence poses an immediate threat to the well-being of those around it.. Such as in a sterile environment or Should they exibhit inappropriate behavior.. Not because of a pre conceived notion as to what MIGHT occur....
 
#13 · (Edited)
Xeph, I hope you don't mind my adding few additional notes for dog guides and GD’s who do service the blind. I know your post was geared towards those who are not blind, but I've heard some really crazy stories from those who are. Below is based on conversations and feedback from folks that I have met over the years who have dog guides.

1) Please do not interfere with the handler and dog. The dog is focusing on following through on commands to guide their owner safely through crowds and traffic. The dog knows a car is coming, even if the owner does not. If you grab the collar or pet the dog, it is similar to grabbing the steering wheel while someone else is driving. They are working together and the dog guide knows what he's doing, even if it doesn't appear that way.

2) Do not offer the dog treats! Again, the dog is working and needs to focus on the task at hand. If the owner wants to provide treats to the dog, that is their prerogative, not yours. (see #1).

3) People with service dogs, are people. They have good days and bad days, social preferences, jobs to perform, places to go, hobbies and interests, likes and dislikes. Be respectful of that and understand, while they may be open to conversation, they may also have more pressing things to do.

4) Don’t assume that the dog is unhappy or working too hard. That serious look on the dog’s face, is the dog focusing, not a statement of their emotions. SD’s actually enjoy performing their job, and they need to focus in order to do it right. They know when they are at work and they know when they can relax and play, (yes, they do get to relax and play). When a dog is working, they are focused on their job, just like you would be at your job.

5) There has been an increase in the number of dog guides attacked by other dogs while in service. Attacks on dog guides have resulted from pet dogs being walked on leash, or tied up outside of a store, or just a loose, roaming dog. If you witness an attack, please do step forward and offer assistance. While an incident can be reported, the owner cannot recover medical bills or press charges without identifying the attacker. Your help with identification, or asking what you can do to help, can make a big difference in the outcome. It is an emotionally and physically distressing situation for both the dog and the owner. In many cases, the dog may end up retiring from service, due to the physical or psychological impact.
 
#15 ·
1) Please do not interfere with the handler and dog. The dog is focusing on following through on commands to guide their owner safely through crowds and traffic. The dog knows a car is coming, even if the owner does not. If you grab the collar or pet the dog, it is similar to grabbing the steering wheel while someone else is driving. They are working together and the dog guide knows what he's doing, even if it doesn't appear that way.
Bubba is going in for final training in two weeks :( but for any future readers of this thread, I cannot stress this enough!! I'm only the trainer, not the blind handler, but we work SO HARD on distractions that shouldn't even occur in the first place due to people just being *too* friendly.
 
#14 ·
I know your post was geared towards those who are not blind
Not really :) Just SDs in general. Though I can see how it may have read that way.

I have a friend who uses a guide dog, but she is not blind. She has a sensory processing disorder and gets lost easily
 
#17 ·
What are the rights of Therapy Dogs and Emotional Support Dogs? Would they train my dog too? My dog really have helped me... I am doing so much better with him in my life! My health has improved and my moods are happier now... still am growing.

I am curious to know. By the way I was curious what Xept has to say about the Private Dog Park question about their policies.
 
#18 ·
Therapy dogs and emotional support dogs, in general, have no public access rights with their handlers. They are not task trained.

Whether or not they are allowed in public places where dogs are generally not accepted is based on the laws of the state you are currently in. Emotional support animals are generally allowed to fly in cabin with their handler.

Any dog that is aggressive towards anybody can be excluded from the premises, service dog or not
 
#20 ·
I want to take my dog with me on my flight, but he is too tall according to their carry on standard nor could I afford it if he was short enough ($150) or to carry him below the plane ($175). I would feel much happier with him by me! I want him to be more trained to be more calm and quiet around other people and animals, so I won't get into trouble.

I see people bring their dogs in stores without anybody saying anything, and they were not service dogs. I am not sure what the laws on this.
 
#21 ·
You have to pay for your dog to fly if you do not truly need an emotional support dog or service dog. End of story. I have to pay for my pet dogs to fly, even though my SD rides with me for free (and there are certain circumstances where he cannot ride with me and must be below the plane).

People that are bringing their non SDs into stores that do not allow dogs are breaking the law and could be cited.
 
#22 ·
Coming from retail management and now owning an SD I have been on both sides of the issue. On the retail management side it's almost never worth approaching a dog and handler due to the liability you open the business up to by potentially discriminating against someone. I wouldn't worry about myself mishandling the issue but I've seen countless times where no matter how well you think you train a sales associate or cashier they screw up in a really big way and next thing you know there are lawyers involved. On the SD handler/owner side of the issue part of me would love it if the stores enforced their "no pets" policy because it would reduce the risk of my animal getting distracted or worse. In reality though I'm pretty satisfied overall with the happy medium that I find in most stores where you might get a nod from the manager upon entrance and then you may see a well behaved pet dog minding it's own business down one of the aisles. I don't appreciate people bringing their pets into public areas or places of public accommodation when they don't necessarily have legally protected access but if store personnel are aware of the dog presence and don't ask the owner to remove the animal then consent is basically implied considering there aren't any laws that strictly prohibit dogs from being in a Home Depot or at the cafe. I like to think that most places reserve the right to ask any misbehaving dog to leave but use their judgment to allow access to well behaved dogs.

The only time I had to ask someone to remove their dog from the store I worked at was when I found a chihuahua tearing through the lumber department off leash and followed him back to his people. I asked the owner to take control of his dog and please remove it from the store for the safety of our customers, staff and the safety of the dog. He told me it was his service dog but I kicked him out anyways. I wasn't about to let that little rascal get run over by a forklift because he had a crappy owner.
 
#23 ·
One of the things that drives me nuts about taking a dog into public is that for some strange reason people will stare him down. My dog Bear is a very sweet and gentle black lab but when he is in work mode, his vest is on and his boy is attached to him his sentinel instincts are turned on so if you're a stranger locking eyes with him could potentially get you bitten. Why someone would think that locking eyes with any dog is a good idea I'll never know.

As far as the No Bully Breeds thing at the private members only dog park that is a good question. It will really depend on whether or not the state has a BSL that targets Pit Bull breeds because that would also extend to Pit Bulls being used as SD's. If the state does not discriminate against Pit Bulls then I would think that the park would have no choice but to grant the Pit Bull SD access because it would do so if the dog were any other breed and a SD is a SD 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year, even when the vest is off and it is catching a frisbee. The park is a place of public accommodation, not to be confused with a publicly owned place, and just like the movie theatre or a restaurant you have to pay to gain access and stay while you enjoy the services so It would be no different at a members only dog park. That policy would discriminate against the person as much as the dog.
 
#26 ·
Great thread.
The outcome of a SD. but the beginning should be addressed also, basic human/dog rights.
I have been all over this life, and no matter on top or what's left for me never has this not been the best way to go.
Get a lawyerise lawyer. Not your family or business guy, but a nice older criminal lawyer.
No one is better at telling you what not to do than a man that spent his life getting others out of what they did.
And his only job for you is to read or make the contract loop hole free.
A service dog or just dog in general has rights, but to enforce those rights the owner/handler needs to have no ground work for the other side to work from.
You need to have gone a little passed what you can humanly do to insure your side. In the eyes of the law.
Have a gate in your fenced in yard? you know to check it after every guest, delivery, sometimes hourly as it is a fact in the laws eyes people leave "others" property and the home owner is the foreseeable person that maintains it. I.E if the lawyer on the other side good you loose.
Only way around it another fenced in area around back door with one key on your person don't hang keys! or a camera and alarm to go off if latch not engaged in so many minutes. In eyes of the law you got a good foundation to show you went above the human limit and now they look at the other side poorly.
Same goes with SD's most owners great but then you get the slackers, Dog in poor shape, not groomed, flea ridden not healthy etc. the owner has a responsibility to offer an animal basic care and safety to the community.
If you leave a foundation as this for a case then you make it easy and poor on other SDs.
The boarders to another country, not all only thinking of Can. to US you need to have the basic shots up to date with proof to get across, same should be enforced by all areas be store, park, another home.
You park area can enforce your dog not only have all basic shots but the bor. one for the cough is contagious.
The vet itself will tell you, as selling it, if you take your dog on public area walks get the added shot and year around flea, this can be used for the park as it is recommended for over all protection of all.
The park needs lawyerise here but if the law is for all then nothing a SD dog can do but comply.
Look into the law for your state if the landlord contract is enforced with higher rates for "risk breeds" then the park may be able to have the same for the user agreement, one law can help or hurt other areas, but if you go this way be set for being perfect yourself.
 
#27 ·
A service dog or just dog in general has rights
No, it does not. Welfare points, yes. Rights? No.

I'm not even sure what the point of your post is, honestly.
 
#28 ·
The right of any dog is to be treated as the state says, I did not say legal right, but the right to be to be safe to the community and as in the law to go over the border a right to basic shots, if you can get a lawyer to word it right using the law to your needs for a better screening to your place or expectations of a SD or just dog.

Using a lawyer can help you or prevent you with a contract when it comes to an area as open as dogs use it for you but protect yourself too.
SD have been boned when it comes to treatment but now people are adding others to cover taking fido anywhere, get a lawyer to protect yourself as I have seen many ways to keep you and your dogs out just by passed care, passed doings and what condition are.
Basic law says anything must be safe to the community, can't get a dog lis. unless you have at least rabies done on him, that holds for getting into a park if you have a agreement drawn up.
You can legally only see your old grandparent when you want to, but if you are on paper responsible not checking up can be abuse if they need more.
You may not want people near your SD got a vest on him to say no petting but if he bites someone that is not going to stop a good lawyer from saying you did not have a safe dog and knew it by saying no petting, you knew the issue was there by placing the patch on in the 1st place.
Talk to a lawyer as SD and just dogs have been used, remember this country sued for a pickle being to hot and they won.
It's nice to say close the gate but how many dogs get out because the gate was left openand you just let him out the back door?
Nice to do up a page of and when I am out you don't do this to me or my dog, I want a parking space to open up for me on lunch hour too when I am on the clock think one will?
People are people and will do as they will reach out and pet your dog, stand in your way even though you need space for two, and yes, people do talk to wheelchairs and you in it as the 3rd person.
In the end if the dog wigs out you will be held responsible, we have 1 time bite law no matter one report next is death.
Agreements can be made for the park as all would have to go by it for safety of all.
So working up a your rude if you pet .... if you talk..... if you whatever really don't matter calling others rude sort of mean anyways. I would not say that anyone not like you is the rude one.
 
#29 ·
Ain't no thang :)
 
#30 ·
Two service dog questions:

-Why have service dogs instead of people who are paid to live with and help the disabled?

-Is there a lot of correction/punishment used in the training process? It's just hard for me to imagine dogs completely ignore ALL distractions without that kind of training.

I know there are many different kinds of service dogs so I guess I'm asking very generally. And I know my questions sound very anti-service dog but really I have a lot of respect for the service dog world and am just asking out of curiosity.
 
#31 · (Edited)
-Why have service dogs instead of people who are paid to live with and help the disabled?
This one I can answer:

Money. Service dogs are expensive, yeah, but nowhere NEAR the amount you would have to pay a person to do what service dogs do - which is basically be on hand 24/7.

And aside from that service dogs don't impact independence by being a major intrusion on a person's life the way another person going everywhere with them, all the time, everywhere would (and frankly, I'd rather have a service dog than another human being shadowing me 24/7). That's not even touching some things dogs can do that people just can't like detect seizures, or the fact that you'd have to hire about 3 people because of shifts, or have someone willing to work twenty four hours a day, seven days a week, doing fairly boring and repetitive tasks. And, again circling back to money.
 
#32 ·
-Is there a lot of correction/punishment used in the training process? It's just hard for me to imagine dogs completely ignore ALL distractions without that kind of training.
This is why dogs are specifically bred or selected to have the proper temperament. There are many dogs that naturally ignore all distractions with only a little bit of training.

Not to mention that not all dogs are designed to ignore all distractions. Hearing Dogs, Guide dogs, etc are supposed to respond to distractions. Their response is redirected, not suppressed.
 
#34 ·
Thanks for the insight guys! I guess these questions partly came up because I was in a pet store the other day and a lady was training service dogs, a pit mix and a beagle mix. They were both wearing gentle leaders and both clearly wanted to interact with other dogs (breaking stays to go greet them, etc) and each of the many times they'd do that, the woman would pull them down to the ground by their gentle leaders. I thought, "well if that's what it takes to get a service dog to not react inappropriately to distractions..."
But I don't know what she was training them to do. She has a facility and runs an organization (forgot the name) to train service dogs for veterans.
 
#35 ·
Not all trainers are the same. I can understand the Pit, but a beagle mix is a strange one. Regardless, I have no doubt there are incompetent trainers out there, just as with anything else in life!
 
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