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And that's where you are wrong. Majority of AR groups believe they are better off dead than 'captive.'
But then this was said. I'm disputing this.
 

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But then this was said. I'm disputing this.
I have never heard open condemnation of PETA's pro-death statements and policies by other AR groups. If they do not agree with them, why don't they speak out? Silence is tacit acceptance.
 

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I believe you have, or at least strongly implied it. Particularly in the anti-docking/cropping threads. Unless you somehow think that being against cropping/docking = doing away with domestic animals. I don't see the connection myself.

If the AR groups themselves don't agree on a definition, how can we say there's a set definition? Especially when that set definition does not actually include any rights for animals?
I think the origin of the anti-docking nonsense is founded in the AR movement. The more they can legislate people's choices in pet ownership the better. The more they can spin common practices into something horrendous, the easier it gets to impose more stringent regulation. I don't think anyone who latches onto it is AR, unless they want to tell me they are. They may simply be uninformed about the procedure or over zealous in thinking they need to force their beliefs on others. I am not big on ear cropping myself. Would not do it myself. However, I don't want to outlaw cropping for people who feel differently. Likewise, it is fine with me if people don't want to dock tails or don't want to own a docked breed. Just don't go looking for ways to legally enforce your values on me. So, which animal rights groups doesn't meet the defintion? Do tell.
 

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I'm not overly familiar with groups that call themselves animal rights groups myself so I can't dispute they exist. What group do you feel calls themselves an animal rights group but doesn't fall under that definition?
Well, these are the groups that haven't yet taken their names off the wikipedia page: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animal_rights_groups. I didn't click on every one of them to see their exact beliefs, but they all evidently self-identify as AR. Many of them are TNR groups or otherwise lobby for pets. They evidently aren't trying to do away with pets.

I am going to point out that being against one (or more) uses of animals is not the same as saying that animals are better off killed or that all human usage of animals should stop.
 

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Well, these are the groups that haven't yet taken their names off the wikipedia page: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animal_rights_groups. I didn't click on every one of them to see their exact beliefs, but they all evidently self-identify as AR. Many of them are TNR groups or otherwise lobby for pets. They evidently aren't trying to do away with pets.

I am going to point out that being against one (or more) uses of animals is not the same as saying that animals are better off killed or that all human usage of animals should stop.
From your wikipedia list: I maintain that those who believe that animals are members of the moral community should, instead, make clear that veganism, defined as not eating, wearing, or using animals is the non-negotiable, unequivocal moral baseline

The Revolutionary Cells – Animal Liberation Brigade (RCALB), known simply as Animal Liberation Brigade, is a name used by animal liberationists who advocate the use of freedom and a diversity of tactics within the animal liberation movement, whether non-violent or not. As part of a praxis, the intention is to destroy oppressive institutions, describing an endgame for animal abusers.[1][2][3]

The Revolutionary Cells is not a group, but an example of a leaderless resistance, as a banner for autonomous, covert cells who carry out direct action similar to the Animal Rights Militia (ARM) or Justice Department.

Founded in the United States, after bombing Chiron and Shaklee's corporate offices in 2003, activists have since used the banner to firebomb vehicles and threaten to send letter bombs to individuals in the California area. Targets have included corporate customers of animal testing laboratory Huntingdon Life Sciences and animal researchers at UCLA and the California National Primate Research Center.[4][5][6]

The FBI issued an arrest warrant for Daniel San Diego for his alleged association with the cell responsible for the 2003 bombings, but has not yet been caught.[3] He is therefore wanted for his suspected involvement in property destruction crime.[7][8]
 

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I didn't say none of them are extremists, just that not all of them are.

I don't think most vegans go that far, or at least they don't consider responsible pet keeping to be "using" animals. I'm sure there's debate in the vegan community about that. Maybe you'll say they don't really understand veganism. . .but hey, they're the vegans, I think they can define their own beliefs.
 

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I didn't say none of them are extremists, just that not all of them are.

I don't think most vegans go that far, or at least they don't consider responsible pet keeping to be "using" animals. I'm sure there's debate in the vegan community about that. Maybe you'll say they don't really understand veganism. . .but hey, they're the vegans, I think they can define their own beliefs.
I'm not talking about veganism. I'm talking about "animal rights" If people want to eat tofurkey, that's their business. (though I find it interesting they want substitute meat if meat is that disgusting.)
 

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Haha, that's what my brother says (he's vegetarian). But he always hated meat, even when he was little. He does like one brand of fake chicken, because-he says-it doesn't taste anything like chicken. But those who are vegetarian/vegan for ethical reasons might still like the taste of meat, so I guess that's why there's a market for it.

I guess I'm not sure why you brought up veganism then.
 

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I guess I'm not sure why you brought up veganism then.
I didn't, actually. I gave a number of excerpts from the page you provided to show that ARs are just good people who like animals (generally). One of those mentioned veganism along with not using animals as the "non-negotiable, unequivocal moral baseline." I thought it wise not too edit to generously and let the information speak for itself.
 
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