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Discussion Starter #1
Our Pap puppy is almost 5 months (19 weeks) and potty training is going pretty well. He is crated while we are gone during the day and then while we are home he goes outside to potty and he does really well with this. Last night I took him out to potty and play ball,we do this a couple of times in the evening to run off some of his energy and he peed outside. I was cleaning up something in the kitchen, maybe an hour or so after we came in and he came slinking into the kitchen, went into his crate and laid on his bed. This is highly unusual behavior. When his crate door is open he is outta there! I walked over and he was just sitting there in his crate with this weird look on his face. It was odd and I knew something was wrong, I called him to me, but he wouldnt come, which was odd as well. I went into the living room and he had peed on the love seat.

What should I have done? He knew that he had done a bad thing. And he had disiplined himself, I just kind of stood there like a dummy for a second. lol I did go get him out of his crate and I showed him the pee spot, I didnt rub him in it or anything like that, I just showed him and I put him outside. I told him that we potty outside. And I left him outside while I cleaned it and put the Simple Solutions stuff on it and prayed to the Doggie Gods to removed the pee smell.

So, what do you do when your dog KNOWS that he did something wrong? Do you reinforce it? If so, how? I'm still not sure I handled it right.
 

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Has he been yelled at or disciplined in a way that frightened him for going in the house in the past? Showing him the pee after the fact doesn't teach him not to pee in the house. He doesn't understand English but it sounds like he thinks you get mad at him when he pees. Unless you catch him in the act & can rush him outside, it's too late. Also, you might think about having a vet check him for urinary tract infection.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
My husband has yelled at him and put him in his crate for peeing in the house. I've never yelled at him though. And I didnt yell at him last night. I may have muttered a few curse words, but I didnt yell at him.
 

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My husband has yelled at him and put him in his crate for peeing in the house. I've never yelled at him though. And I didnt yell at him last night. I may have muttered a few curse words, but I didnt yell at him.
Okay, so the crate has been used as punishment. Not good. Tell your husband to stop yelling at the infant dog and you stop cursing at him & making him feel like crap for doing what comes naturally. He needs to be gently taught the rules of the house. He didn't come to you knowing them. He doesn't understand English. Please read the stickies at the top of the New Dog Owner section of the forum. There is lots of help for potty training issues. Remember, you're dealing with a very, very young animal. Treat him with kindness, not yelling and punishment.

Keep repeating this to yourself: Puppies can do no wrong. It's the humans who mess up.

Here's a link for you. http://www.dogforums.com/first-time-dog-owner/88458-enough-potty-threads.html
 

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He didn't know that he did something wrong, and he wasn't disciplining himself. He's simply learned that "pee + humans in the house = I'm not safe from scary yelling monsters" and he was probably trying to hide.

What I would do about it is change the way I was housetraining to eliminate any yelling, which doesn't teach them what we think it teaches them anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
OK...I just read the Potty training sticky. Humans have screwed up. He loves cheese. And I always go out with him to potty, so I will name his pee and poos now and reward him and get us all on the right track of training. My hubs will be the hardest one to train. He loves Dexter, but he expects far too much from a very young pup.

I have another question. The "excited widdle" or excited pee. Is there a way to get them to stop doing this?
 

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OK...I just read the Potty training sticky. Humans have screwed up. He loves cheese. And I always go out with him to potty, so I will name his pee and poos now and reward him and get us all on the right track of training. My hubs will be the hardest one to train. He loves Dexter, but he expects far too much from a very young pup.

I have another question. The "excited widdle" or excited pee. Is there a way to get them to stop doing this?
Yea! I'm so glad. Husbands ARE harder to train than puppies, LOL.

The excitement peeing may just be a matter of maturity. Molly used to do that when someone came over & she was all excited greeting them but she grew out of it. I started taking Molly out for a potty break right before we were expecting guests so that at least there would be a lot less of it. She learned what "pee" means because I would repeat that word while she was doing it during her training period.
 

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My husband is much harder to train than the dogs, too. OMGosh if there were only a husband forum!
OK...I just read the Potty training sticky. Humans have screwed up. He loves cheese. And I always go out with him to potty, so I will name his pee and poos now and reward him and get us all on the right track of training. My hubs will be the hardest one to train. He loves Dexter, but he expects far too much from a very young pup.

I have another question. The "excited widdle" or excited pee. Is there a way to get them to stop doing this?
 

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I have another question. The "excited widdle" or excited pee. Is there a way to get them to stop doing this?
Hamilton does this sometimes -- especially with his favorite "aunties" (my good friends who come to the house all the time). I've solved it by opening the back door and letting him greet them outside when they come over. He does his super excited dance, sometimes drips some pee, but I don't care cause it's just the back deck. I'm hoping he'll just grow out of it.
 

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One of my dogs, who is a year-old still does excited peeing. Really, he pees anytime he has any high emotion. Gets excited: pee, some loud outside noise scares him: pee (not all the time, though), gets to playing: pee.

We are still working on it with him, and it is becoming less frequent so I do have hope.

I would say just supervise your puppy better. Tell your husband anytime the puppy has an accident "You made a mistake, not the dog". It's our responsibilities as their "parents" to care for them, make sure we always get them outside on time, and ensure they do no wrong (haha, good luck with that one). Good luck though; sorry you've had this set back.
 

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My husband is much harder to train than the dogs, too. OMGosh if there were only a husband forum!
Ain't that the truth! I had to give explicit instructions to not discipline the dog, that I would do it. My pup is too young for 'No!' or any other form of discipline, but it keeps my husband and kids from screwing her up.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Last night went really well with potty training. I made 2 mistakes, though. Dexter was perfect, though. When we first walk in the door, I try to immediately get him outside, as he will do the excited dribble all over the kitchen, living room and the living room furniture. So, I get him out of his crate and immediately put him outside. Yesterday, my 3 year old was being difficult and I couldnt immediately go out with Dexter, so I dealt with my son, got him taken care of, then I opened the door to go out and play ball and insure that Dexter peed and pooed if he had to. Dexter shot back in the door, jumped on the love seat and peed all over it and my son. It wasnt a complete pee, it was the excited dribble, but it he needed to pee, so it was ALOT of excited dribble. I didnt yell or anything. I just said "come on,let's go" and I got cheese for a treat, and we went outside. We played ball a little and he peed, I said go pee pee and gave him his cheese and he was estatic. lol He pooed a short time later and I said go poo, and gave him his cheese. He did that 2 more times, peed and pooed and got his cheese.

I spoke with my husband and explained what you all told me about yelling at him. I also explained submissive peeing because Dexter does this with my husband and it makes my husband angry. When I explained why he does it, he understood and I explained how to better approach him, kneeling down, as opposed to standing over him, let Dex come to him, instead of reaching for him, and petting his chest first, instead of the top of his head. Anyway, hopefully this will help some too.

I feel like I have a better plan for potty training and he is responding very well to it. He LOVES cheese and is starting to connect the two together as well as the words. We just have to be way more vigilant in the house. We tend to give him too much freedom in the house and "expect" him to control himself. That is where we screw up. As new puppy owners we are putting way too much pressure on an infant pup. Thank you to you all for pointing that out to me.
 

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Well you and your husband deserve medals for taking the advice that people gave you. You'd be surprised how many people don't. You're doing a great job with your puppy, good luck moving forward!
 

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Well, save the medals for about 2 weeks from now. It's easy to start something, but having the momentum to follow the routine and keep on track, and not get lazy about it is where the medal awarding comes in. lol Just say a prayer to the Puppy Gods for fortitude for Catdancer. haha!!
 

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Yea! I'm so glad to read this! Kudos to you!! You'll be much happier with the relationship you build with Dexter. Something that I found very helpful during potty training was to keep a chart on the fridge so I could track her potty activities. It worked well to help me begin to predict when she might need to go next.
 

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you're puppy knows that when there's pee spots, he gets in trouble. But he's probably not sure what he can do about it other than hide. I agree with the others - after the fact anger isn't training. At this point strict supervision is. If he was properly supervised he wouldn't have been able to pee oin the sofa. So supervise, supervise, supervise. If he has an inside potty spot I would use litter box or turf, since puppy pads are like many other soft flat surfaces in the houseand the substrate of grass or dirt like litter is closer to outside. It's refreshing to see someone who comes for advice and listens, and takes the advice the way it's intended. (Some people get mad if you can't offer a quick fix). Good luck training the hubby!
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
We're making progress!!! Dexter is responding really well to the cheese and the words pee and poo. Pee moreso than poo. We did have one pee accident last evening, completely my fault, as we were moving a new bed into our bedroom and I didnt catch his signal to go out and he peed right by the back door on the linoleum. Again, another way of telling me that he tried to go outside, but I didnt get him out, know what I mean? I just cleaned it up, I didnt even acknowledge it, he stood right there looking at me, just kind of waiting and I didnt say anything, when I was done, I grabbed the cheese, his ball and said let's go outside, and he happily raced to the door.

The training of my husband is going surprising well too. Because of the hours that he works, I am the one who takes Dexter out of most, if not all, of his potty breaks. The biggest thing with my hubs, is him not yelling at Dex and him not using his crate as punishment and also how he approaches Dex so he doesnt intimidate him resulting in the "submissive pee". Last night when hubs got home, I had Dex on our bed after we had been outside two separate times peeing and pooing, and we were playing with his toys and wrestling. Hubs came in and this is usually when Dex would do the submissive pee on my $200 dry clean only comforter, I was scrambling to get him off the comforter, when my hubs knelt down, didnt say anything and just rested his head on the edge of the bed. Dex came over to him licked his face and brought him his toy. Then they played and my hubs sat down on the bed, no peeing. Woo hoo!! I know that there will be slip ups on both parts, but at least my hubs tried what I told him and it worked!!! Thanks again for all of your good advice!

So, the training of both puppy and husband is progressing, slowly but surely. :)
 

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First off, I don't reccomend that you use the crate as punishment. Dogs should love thier crate. Give him a Nylabone or sterilized beef bone or other safe (semi-indestructable) toy he loves every time he's in his crate. Also, I don't reccomend using cheese as a very frequent reward. Many dogs have dairy issues. Use it sometimes, but mix it up with things like hot dog, Buddy Biscuits (my personal favorite commercial dog treat) and even his regular kibble. Studies show that intermittantcy in rewards make dogs more likely to obey. Do reward him with praise and some kind of food each time he relieves appropriately.
Like others said, your dog wasn't disciplining himself, he just was afraid of getting yelled at, so he hid in his crate. Dogs do not have any feeling of guilt, what people see as guilt is actually usually fear. Make sure that everybody in the house knows that yelling is not okay. Since dogs don't have a long attention span, and they have very bad short term memory, YOU SHOULD NEVER DISIPLINE THEM AFTER THE FACT. I apologize for the caps lock, but you should always remember this in any situation, even if it does not relate to potty training. Many people don't realize this, and then they end up giving inefective punishment. Rubbing thier nose in it or showing them it and scolding them is just plain cruel and they will not understand what you are trying to tell them, and they may become fearfull of peeing/pooing altogether.

On to what you should do: When you are around Dexter in the house, try putting him on a leash and always holding onto it. (or if he is not a big puller, you can tie it around your waist) This is called umbilical cording. It will also help teach him to stay near you when on a leash, and prevent him from taking forbidden objects. Just go about your daily activities with him in tow. He is less likely to pee or poo if he is tied to you, but if he does, then you can give him a firm, quiet, un-angered vocal correction such as "Don't" or "Wrong" (I prefer not to use "No" because it is a very easy to overuse word) if he continues to relieve, you can give a leash correction (only if you are comfortable doing so.) Get him outside as fast as you can, wait for him to continue relieving, then praise and treat him like crazy.
As he advances, you can also do this in a similar way, execpt without holding onto the other end of the leash. Just keep him in your line of sight, letting him drag the leash, and follow the same steps if he starts to inappropriately relieve.

I love the idea from JulieK1967 about a potty chart! Try that, and see how it goes. Then you can just take him out at the times he seems he always needs to go.

I think you should talk with your husband (and any other family members if you have them, even the smallest of children) about training, handling, and disiplining procedures, so that you are all on the same page. Establish a rule that says that if one person is angry at the dog they should not handle him, instead they should get the someone else to handle him. By avoiding anger, you are avoiding stress on the dog, and you are being a good pack leader. A pack leader does not need anger, because it makes them seem out of control, and being a pack leader is all about control.

I wen't on and on, and could have gone longer, but I hope I have given you some helpful hints, and like Pawzk9 I would like you to know that I admire you for your willingness to take other people's advice and adapt your methods, rather than just getting angry because it is not a quick fix (there is no such thing as a quick fix in dog training). Also, good job training your husband! People are sure harder to train then dogs. I wish you the best of luck with Dexter, and can feel your potential as a super expert dog trainer!
 

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My husband is much harder to train than the dogs, too. OMGosh if there were only a husband forum!
Believe it or not ...there "ARE" a couple of those forums out there! Lol! :)
 
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