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Hi, everyone,
I see another thread recently on pinch collars, but I don't want to hijack it.
Last night, I took Duke to his first obedience class. He **normally** listens very well to me when we're training at home, but I thought obedience class could be good because I wasn't sure how he'd be around other dogs.
First, I'll say that the other dogs were a huge problem, and their owners seemed to totally accept their behavior. For instance, I kept getting Duke to sit nice at my feet, and another dog kept running over (on its leash!) and jumping on him and barking in his face.
The trainer had us start class by walking clockwise around the room with our dogs and she recorded it on her iPad to show us a before/after when she tapes again at the last class. Though Duke normally heels fine for me (we worked really hard on that on walks at home), he strained and pulled a bit, especially as other dogs stopped in front of him and kept running back to him to sniff and try to instigate play, or as dogs behind him ran up to him and bumped into him from behind and beside.
Right after that, the trainer had us all sit in chairs with our dogs, and she showed us collars she recommended for everyone to buy. For most little dogs, she provided what she called slip collars (I think they're called martingales). For Duke, about 18 weeks/35+ pounds, and one other dog, she recommended what she called a prong collar. I think this is a pinch collar that chokes. She showed everyone how to do "leash corrections" the "correct way," and then put the dogs in the new collars.
She told me to correct the minute he pulled, and when I did (not hard!), he literally screamed and cried. He did it again, and she told me not to correct anymore since "he is such a big baby, he'll train himself!" He did not pull anymore that night. At the end of the night, she told me to take the collar home and bring her the money for it next week.
I readily agreed, as it really did seem to work. Now that I've had the night to reflect and to read up on prong collars on this forum, I'm worried that:
1) The collar could seriously hurt him.
2) The collar isn't humane.
3) He could learn just as well, though maybe with more time, with a normal collar that won't cause aversion to situations. (He seemed very happy, but I don't want him to associate classes, or walks, with pain.)
4) The collar is just a "quick fix," and the "lesson" won't last if we go back to a normal collar. (The trainer recommends I leave it on him all the time.)
I really thought the trainer was very nice, but now that I think about it, I wonder if she was trying to give everyone "quick fixes" so they feel she's a really good trainer/miracle worker, and if she wasn't trying to just make money.
I can't get a refund for the class, and I do think we can benefit from it, so I don't think we should avoid returning for the remainder of our classes, but I'm just feeling really confused right now.
Regarding both the collar AND the trainer, what would you all do? What do you think?
Thank you in advance from both Duke and me!
I see another thread recently on pinch collars, but I don't want to hijack it.
Last night, I took Duke to his first obedience class. He **normally** listens very well to me when we're training at home, but I thought obedience class could be good because I wasn't sure how he'd be around other dogs.
First, I'll say that the other dogs were a huge problem, and their owners seemed to totally accept their behavior. For instance, I kept getting Duke to sit nice at my feet, and another dog kept running over (on its leash!) and jumping on him and barking in his face.
The trainer had us start class by walking clockwise around the room with our dogs and she recorded it on her iPad to show us a before/after when she tapes again at the last class. Though Duke normally heels fine for me (we worked really hard on that on walks at home), he strained and pulled a bit, especially as other dogs stopped in front of him and kept running back to him to sniff and try to instigate play, or as dogs behind him ran up to him and bumped into him from behind and beside.
Right after that, the trainer had us all sit in chairs with our dogs, and she showed us collars she recommended for everyone to buy. For most little dogs, she provided what she called slip collars (I think they're called martingales). For Duke, about 18 weeks/35+ pounds, and one other dog, she recommended what she called a prong collar. I think this is a pinch collar that chokes. She showed everyone how to do "leash corrections" the "correct way," and then put the dogs in the new collars.
She told me to correct the minute he pulled, and when I did (not hard!), he literally screamed and cried. He did it again, and she told me not to correct anymore since "he is such a big baby, he'll train himself!" He did not pull anymore that night. At the end of the night, she told me to take the collar home and bring her the money for it next week.
I readily agreed, as it really did seem to work. Now that I've had the night to reflect and to read up on prong collars on this forum, I'm worried that:
1) The collar could seriously hurt him.
2) The collar isn't humane.
3) He could learn just as well, though maybe with more time, with a normal collar that won't cause aversion to situations. (He seemed very happy, but I don't want him to associate classes, or walks, with pain.)
4) The collar is just a "quick fix," and the "lesson" won't last if we go back to a normal collar. (The trainer recommends I leave it on him all the time.)
I really thought the trainer was very nice, but now that I think about it, I wonder if she was trying to give everyone "quick fixes" so they feel she's a really good trainer/miracle worker, and if she wasn't trying to just make money.
I can't get a refund for the class, and I do think we can benefit from it, so I don't think we should avoid returning for the remainder of our classes, but I'm just feeling really confused right now.
Regarding both the collar AND the trainer, what would you all do? What do you think?
Thank you in advance from both Duke and me!