[Freekshow]

After doing really heavy research about Border Collie, I'm fairly sure that the breed is for me.

However, something concerns me.

I hear theres a lot of problems with females with new-time BC owners. I really don't feel like having a b*tch in my house trying to dominate me and being serious, so a male would probably fit me better as he is more chill and goofy. Mind you, I am NOT a new dog owner. I've had lots. But what I've read about female BC owners..sounds like a hassle. With all the nipping and what not.

(http://www.bordercollie.org/boards/index.php)

So, any BC owners that can help me out - do you think I should go for male or do you think it wont matter?

 

[tirluc]

really, i don't think the sex is what's gonna matter the most here.....if you're not "smarter" than the Border, you're gonna have problems, plain and simple....what you need to worry about is the drive.....i would recommend going thru a rescue and working w/ them on the right dog for you.....

Border's are extremely intelligent and if they can outsmart you, they will.....w/out the proper outlet for the drive of the dog, and w/out the proper training, you can have problems....

i don't see where my girls are any more/less nippy than my boys, just more down to business and more attitude.....

 

[Lonewolfblue]

As for me, I don't think there's much difference between the male and female other than the female being more down to business. Since you've had other dogs before, then I don't think you'll have much of a problem with a Border Collie, as long as you know the needs of the Border Collie. Nell was my first BC, and she's a gem. But if I'm not on my game, like when I was online and lost track of time, she had my blanket in the master bedroom torn to shreds, lol. They love looking for the filler, lol. I had white filler all over the room, lol.

So, I wouldn't be concerned about male or female. My neighbors male BC is just as bonkers as my female. I just recommend that if you are looking into rescue, then spend some time with the BC before you make the committment. Visit several times. Also be open to other BC's as well, and that right one will pop out, and it may be a male, or it may be a female. Just don't jump on the first one you see. Get to know them first.

So, any BC owners that can help me out - do you think I should go for male or do you think it wont matter?

It doesn't matter....

 

[Elana55]

I really don't feel like having a b*tch in my house trying to dominate me and being serious,

I would be more concerend about thinking a dog could "dominate" me than whether or not a BC is right or a male and a female is right....

Border Collies, male or female, with lots of drive will show herding tendencies, which may include herding people. If you get a BC I hope beyond hope you plan on a couple of hours a day (minimum) workout PLUS lot of training and some sort of JOB for the dog (like agility or herding).

A BC that is not tired and is bored will come up with things to do. Those things may not be the things you want either. Maybe you have considered all of this, but it is worthwhile to consider it AGAIN b4 you get the dog.

 

[Freekshow]

A BC that is not tired and is bored will come up with things to do. Those things may not be the things you want either. Maybe you have considered all of this, but it is worthwhile to consider it AGAIN b4 you get the dog.

Aye, that I am very aware of. I have really researched all info possible about the border collie. I originally planned going with a Australian Shepherd, but all the kennels here want 1500-1700$ which I think is rediculous. As I couldn't find any kennels nor private families that had litters/pup, I thought I'd look for another breed, and the Border Collie, while more serious and "driven" than the Aussie would also suit me.

I don't plan herding with my BC as a I live no where near a farm. Agility..while I do plan play a lot of frisbee, lots of runs and lots of swimming lessons at the beach, I won't participate in professional agility lessons.
While I have no yard, I do have forests, flat-fields, beach with a dog-only beach, dog park and even more fields. Perfect for BCs and in fact any other dog .

I think I setteld with male. I don't think the difference between male vs female is big, but I will definately be on the safe side and chose male.
Don't think I have any more questions..
Perhaps one,

When is the *appropriate* time for a BC/dog to get neutered? Obviously I won't neuter my puppy, but I'm thinking maybe 1 ½ year could be the right time?

 

[tirluc]

one thing that i'd like to point out is that i have yet to meet the BC that really wants to "dominate" their owner....they like a partnership, not a domination....they want to work with you, not for you....as for agility, you don't have to get serious about it to do it just take some classes for the fun of it....they really do love it....plus, there's rally, which they get more bored w/ but it's better than simple obedience work for them.....

just so you know, w/ mine, i spend at least 2 hrs a day of play time (winters are a bit less and i tend to pay for it in the "bug mom" department...but, so far no destruction), plus there is the training, the mind games (find things, get things out of containers, etc) and 2 days of the wk 2 of mine go to classes (the other 2 don't go to classes cuz one is 10 and the other has a problem w/ her throat right now and i won't use a collar on her).....in the spring/fall we have our goosing job which gives them an outlet for that instinct, as well......

when to get your male neutered?....i recommend between 8 mo to 1 yr.....

 

[Lonewolfblue]

one thing that i'd like to point out is that i have yet to meet the BC that really wants to "dominate" their owner....they like a partnership, not a domination...

That is exactly how Nell is. No domination at all...

 

[tirluc]

but, i'll bet she sure likes that partnership, right?....i know mine respond sooo much better when i approach things as partners than as "do as i say, cuz i'm the boss"

 

[sheltiemom]

but, i'll bet she sure likes that partnership, right?....i know mine respond sooo much better when i approach things as partners than as "do as i say, cuz i'm the boss"

Shiner is the same way too, and really so is my female aussie...she is not bossy or bitchy or anything like that. She has more drive than my bc, but that's individual and I don't think sex related.

 

[Lonewolfblue]

but, i'll bet she sure likes that partnership, right?....i know mine respond sooo much better when i approach things as partners than as "do as i say, cuz i'm the boss"

yup.......

 

[Elana55]

Agree with all the partnership comments. BC's are not servants. Fact is, most dogs I have been around do better as partners than as servants.

I was going to get a BC and ended up getting another GSD instead. Trust me.. I still would like a BC but for now one dog is enough. I studied BC's and talked to their owners and spent a LOT of time with the breed.. and I still love them a lot. Partners they are. A more intelligent breed of dog you cannot find.

FWIW $1500 for a dog from a reputable breeder is not an excessive price.

 

[Trixie]

I'm sort of curious, why do you think a border collie is the right dog for you? I think you might be underestimating their drive, since you have no real plans for the dog.

I love border collies, but the one I knew with no real job or purpose other than to be a pet, was totally neurotic. She was a good dog (a very good dog) but she was really bored and loopy. It seems a little like missing the point when you're worried about males vs. females of the breed, rather than the training and the work the dog will need to do to be a well-rounded dog.

And around here (Appalachia), a well-bred border collie goes for $1200. (I think. No less than that, from the breeder I know of)

 

[Freekshow]

I'm sort of curious, why do you think a border collie is the right dog for you? I think you might be underestimating their drive, since you have no real plans for the dog.

I love border collies, but the one I knew with no real job or purpose other than to be a pet, was totally neurotic. She was a good dog (a very good dog) but she was really bored and loopy. It seems a little like missing the point when you're worried about males vs. females of the breed, rather than the training and the work the dog will need to do to be a well-rounded dog.

And around here (Appalachia), a well-bred border collie goes for $1200. (I think. No less than that, from the breeder I know of)

Why? Several factors. I don't wanna go offtopic too much, but generally the BC represents me in many ways, sporty, hard working, "whats it in for me", etc. The size of the pet also helped a bit. A full adult german shepherd or golden retrievers can be massive. I don't have the biggest apartment and I don't think that I could provide the space for the dogs. Some may argue that the BC requires even more space, but a smaller dog is more appropriate than a hulk (each their own). I had 1 miniature german shepherd, got one now and my sister has a cojack (corgi-mix). The last one is a bit taller than my shepherd but dear lord, its a no-stop dog.
The mental stimulation that the BC requires is no worry to me. I have taught my sisters dogs its commands in less than a day (he picks it up so fast) and I go out about 1-2h daily depending on weather and play tons of ball-catching and running.

The Border Collie costs considerably less than the aussie. The price canges from 100 to 500$ while the aussie is (exact price, calculated over 7 kennels) 1800$ - thats my paycheck monthly and some may argue with me that if I can't afford that, how can I afford food? Long answer short, a bag of dry food and a can of wet food doesnt cost 50$ a bag/can. Varies from 2-10$ I think I can handle that

 

[tirluc]

"sporty, hardworking" yes, but i have never known a BC to have a "what's in it for me" attitude....their attitude is "what can we do together..." ......they don't go gather up the woolies b/c they "get something in return....or do agility, flyball, rally, or anything that they do.....it's all wanting to be a part of what you and them can do together....and, in an apt it is going to be hard to keep that drive down....i live in a house where i can play w/ them thru/out the rooms, making tons of noise while ruff-housing and not disturb neighbours and it still can be pretty hard (these on the "bad" days where i can't get them out to run)

personally, i think you're barking up the wrong tree on this breed, but TMO....

 

[Trixie]

tirluc, you beat me to it! (I was going to use the exact phrase "barking up the wrong tree")

I would recommend checking out English Springer Spaniels, especially for an apartment dog. They are also sporty and hardworking, but are much more about pleasing their owner/handler. (I don't know if they are more/less so than BCs, but they DO want to please their handler) They are about the same size although a bit stockier. And I would go through a rescue since there are so many in rescue. Lots of people have trouble getting past the 8 month crazies.

But while BCs are not recommended for apartments, Springers do fine in apartments with sufficient exercise. My dog is a mix of the 2 (and probably other random breeds, but ESS and BC are her dominent ones) and she mellows out nicely in our small-ish house.

Also, just an aside, I think you have grossly underestimated your costs.

 

[Freekshow]

I don't agree. I've visited BC kennels before and babysit a BC in my own apartment. It's easy to judge, but I think you guys misunderstood the part where I said I didn't have a big apartment. Obviously, It's not a temple but it has 4 rooms and enough space to run around for.

Won't explain it further, but I definitely don't see anything wrong in having a BC in a relative small apartment if you can provide what the BC needs.
Also about the spaniel..I've made up my mind, but a simple google search didn't find any kennels nor FAQ-sites (well, not in Danish). Note: I'm from Denmark, very small country, but the aussie is definately not popular here.
I think BC will fit me well. Obviously I don't expect happy days with the BC, but certainly I see as the dog for me