[ScramblesTheDeathDealer]

Hello everyone!
i am considering weather or not i should get a dog sometime in the future, But i don't know what kind i want...

I don't really know anything about dogs, but i do know that i like the "australian cattle dogs" or "heeler" dogs. they are very intelligent, and they look really awesome
(especially the pointy ears and the shape of their heads)

Does anyone know about a breed of dog that looks similar to the australian cattle dog, But are less aggressive and that demand less physical activity and are generally easier to handle?

Thanks

 

[theyogachick]

I can tell you that an ACD is not the dog for a first time owner who knows nothing about dogs. They are headstrong, need a lot of training and very demanding.

If I were you, I would contact local rescue groups and tell them what your lifestyle is like and see if they can match you up with a dog who fits your life. DOn't worry so much about breed--worry about what suits you. For example, if you are not willing to provide exercise for hours a day, any herding/working dogs are not for you. If you aren't willing to get up a few times during the night to take a dog outside to potty, a puppy is not for you.

Getting a dog is a life changing decision. You have to commit, realize there may be issues, and be willing to put forth the time and effort. (Example: I love the looks of aussies, but I also know that my lifestyle would not provide the time/exercise that an aussie needs, so I won't get an aussie. It isn't that I don't want to put in the time and effort--I really don't have the time.)

Choosing a dog just based on looks is not the way to go. They are not accesories--they are living things with needs. You need to take all of that into consideration.

 

[hanksimon]

Any medium to large dog requires about 30 min walking every day, twice a day is better. You'll also need minimal training - at least one class. You probably would not be happy with the average herding breed, because they tend to be higher energy, requiring a little more experience. Also, Adult retrievers may fit your requirements, but I believe that the puppies can be some of the more challenging to raise.

So, I agree with yagochick to go look at the rescue organizations, now, to start learning about some of the young adults up for adoption. The volunteers should help you understand what's available and what's involved.

 

[adnapidna]

Check out a book called: A Member of the Family - by Cesar Millan. Even if you don't agree with his methods of training, the first chapter is great for people trying to understand what type of dog to get. Good luck!

 

[giantbrain12521]

All good points. The bottom line is you gotta educate yourself, because there is A LOT to learn and remember if you want to do it right and provide a safe, happy life for a dog.

I'd also check out another of Cesar's books: How to Raise the Perfect Dog. This will give you (at least from Cesar's perspective,) day-by-day, step-by-step insight into what's involved in raising a healthy, well-adjusted dog. But by all means, do not make this decision lightly!

I'll tell you this, though; the joys of forming and developing a relationship with a dog are quite profound. Hope it all works out!

 

[Pynzie]

I would definitely not recommend Cesar Millan for the first time dog owner who doesn't know much yet. If you are going to get anything positive from Cesar, you have to know what you are looking for (aka you have to have prior knowledge). Otherwise, I am afraid you would believe everything he says (he can be very convincing) and you could end up doing any dog more harm than good.

If you want to learn, you are much better off sticking around here and learning more about positive training methods.

I agree with the above, that any dog requires at least some work, but herding breeds are really up there in terms of exercise and training requirements. I can't really think of another breed with the same look right off the top of my head, although perhaps you can get close with a mixed breed. I agree that you should just head down to a local shelter, take a look around, and talk to the people there. I know you could find a dog that fits your lifestyle but is also physically appealing to you.

 

[adnapidna]

I did not recommend Cesar for training.
I recommended him to choose the dog.

He mentions that a lazy person should not have an active dog. And an active person would not be happy with a lazy dog. He mentions that a person should examine the way the dog acts and not the way a dog looks. This is a common mistake people make - my sister, for instance, LOVES the look of a westie, but she would do really poorly with a westie because she is not terribly active and would not be able to handle it as a dog.

To each everyone's own for training methods and desires. I agree, however, that the energy level of the dog should be matched carefully with the energy level of the owner.

 

[Pynzie]

I did not recommend Cesar for training.
I recommended him to choose the dog.

I know.

But really, no one is going to buy a book and only read the first chapter. The first chapter might be good, but I wouldn't want the rest of the chapters giving a new dog owner the wrong idea. There are other ways to learn about picking a dog without the risk of picking up wrong information along with it. That's all.

 

[luvntzus]

It looks like another case of post and run from the OP.

 

[giantbrain12521]

Pynzie, let me preface my question by saying that I'm really just genuinely curious. But what are people's issues with Cesar?

The reason why I ask is because I spent a number of years stumbling with my seriously dog-aggressive and men-suspicious lab/pit, controlling her by main strength mostly, but not able to change her behavior. Either too few clues or too many, one or the other. But I've been working with Misty for nearly 4 years with many of Cesar's techniques and the results have been nothing short of phenomenal. Her previous aggressive intensity is completely a thing of the past; we have great walks, and even in those infrequent moments when she does 'rise' to another dog, she responds to my re-direction without fail. She greets anyone (even strange men) who comes to our home with appropriate etiquette. She has a great relationship with everyone in the family and seems at all times, comfortable and content her daily routines. So it has worked for me and I guess I'm just not being bashful about it.

I do agree wholeheartedly that, certainly from what I've seen so far, this forum is a marvelous source of all kinds of helpful, insightful and positive information and opinions. That, plus the opportunity to have dialogues, share viewpoints and maybe learn a thing or two were the major reasons why I wanted to sign up here, and I've not been disappointed. So thank you for that!

 

[Pynzie]

That's great that it worked for your aggressive dog, as using aversive training can make an aggressive dog much worse! Think about it - a scary man comes by and my owner pokes me/alpha rolls me, oh man, I'd better keep those bad men away so that my owner doesn't do that to me anymore! --> worse aggression.

I'm not going to explain all the reasons that have been posted before, I suggest you search "Cesar" on DF and read some of the posts for a more extensive list of reasons from more experienced and better trainers than myself. But just a few things - 1. Cesar admits this himself - he is not a behaviorist. He advises that no one repeat the methods that they see on his show without consulting a professional 2. Aversive training is old school and has since been replaced with more progressive and more effective positive methods. Aversives just make good TV. 3. A lot of the dogs he "fixes" by "distracting" them and alpha rolling them are actually just so shut down that they can't do anything anymore. It's not "submission," it's just him and the owner totally breaking the dog until it completely gives up and shuts down - not a healthy thing to do to a dog at all. Besides, the alpha roll has been disproven by wolf researchers anyway - the alpha wolf does not physically roll any other wolf, the others willingly assume the position because they respect the leader, not because they fear him. Being a bully, which is what alpha rolling and these "distraction" jabs are, does not make your dog respect you.

That's just a few things I can think of off the top of my head. It's a super touchy subject that has been discussed many times before (hence why you should search it) and many DF members are quite tired of it. Basically, the best trainers and behaviorists don't use his methods. If they work, you got lucky, because there is a much greater chance that using his aversive methods will make problems worse, and if used on a healthy dog, can create problems and totally break down the relationship between dog and owner.

Like I said, he does make some good points - like one I can think of is how he says he trains humans. But to me, the problems his training methods create outweigh any good that can come from the correct things he says. You can get those good things from positive trainers as well, so why not just get it from them and avoid all the bad/incorrect things he says? I'm sure he's a good person and he's doing what he thinks is best for the dogs, there are just much much much better methods, and I think it is very sad that he is so mainstream, as it causes people to think that he methods are the best when they definitely are not.

PS. I appreciate that you are coming into it with a general curiosity. I am definitely not interested in getting into a Cesar debate, but have no problem answering questions to the best of my ability and directing to threads that probably have better and more extensive answers than myself.

Also, I would really suggest reading Patricia McConnel's book "The Other End of the Leash" as it is a wonderful introduction to dog behavior, and a super easy and fun read. I wish that her book was as popular as Cesar Milan; if it was, I bet there would be a lot more happy dogs in the world.

 

[RonE]

Does anyone know about a breed of dog that looks similar to the australian cattle dog, But are less aggressive and that demand less physical activity and are generally easier to handle?

A really, really old Australian cattle dog.

I'd advise against choosing a dog for its looks. Looks will grow on you. Instead, choose one for its temperament. That's why I don't really have a favorite breed. I like labs, for example, but some labs are incredibly obnoxious. (I actually have one of those living here now, but we're working on it.)

 

[lisak_87]

Does anyone know about a breed of dog that looks similar to the australian cattle dog, But are less aggressive and that demand less physical activity and are generally easier to handle?

Thanks

An adult mutt whose temperment is well known would probably be your best bet there.

I wouldn't go puppy at all if you don't want physically active or handling difficulties.

 

[RonE]

LISTEN VERY CAREFULLY: We are not going to turn this thread into yet another Cesar Milan debate. Please refer to any one of the previous 289 Dog Whisperer threads or, if you must, start a new one. Any future mention of Cesar on this thread will be considered seriously off-topic and deleted.

 

[dms]

If you want a really lazy dog that would be a english bulldog but they do have a great personality. Mine is 11 years old and I swear she understands everything we say. She is great at judging people in fact the only time she tried bite anyone was my x-husband lol.