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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Two dogs- Shih tzu 1.5 years old and a 7 pound, 9 month old poodle.

Both were eating Purina One, Pro Plan, and Science diet dry. Cesars and Nutro wet. ( Yes, I know.) Then I started doing my research.

Innova Green bag, small bites dry- Neither dog wants any parf of it.
Innova Wet, all varieties- Same as above
Innova Evo red bites- Hey they like this one ok, but then I was told that the protein count might be too high for my small dogs, especially the shih tzu? Does seem to make the shih tzu a little gassy.

Wellness- Wet and Dry-All Flavors- Won't eat it.

Taste of the Wild-Dry, Buffalo ( which I now understand has more chicken in it than buffalo?) Shih Tzu will eat it if had fed as a treat...so she will probably convert. Poodle wants no part of it. I would like to be able to feed both dogs the same food.

Merrick canned- most varieties-They don't love it, but I can get them to eat it. Since buying it I have some concerns about Merrick's quality control in their canning process and customer service ( customer service to me means being pro active if there are any concerns over the quality of the food as well as responding to inquiries.). Also I am not so sure about some of preservative ingredients. Shih tzu and poodle both get a little gassy.

Merrick before grain Chicken dry- Both will eat this. See above and also I have read some issues about mold in dry food shipped directly to people from the plant?? Also a bit concerned of the yeast since the poodle has itchy ears at times...and the added salt in it.


Evangers Wet most varieties-(except below) Again dogs don't like it, besides ratings are good but I about had a heart attach when I read about their past FDA issues ( Risk of botulism concern for me.)

Evangers- Canned whole chicken thigh- Boy oh Boy do the dogs love this one. Whole chicken, skin and bones included in what looks like chicken drippings) . Problem is this sure looks fatty and I am not so sure this is healthy. Yes, I tried adding it to the kibble. Even if I soak the kibble in it till it is soggy, Poodle will eat around it, shih tzu will get fooled a little better. :D ( neither dog will eat green bag innova no matter what I do to it.)


Welness Core- Wet and Dry varieties- Neither dog like it.

Canacide- Haven't tried it yet, but from what I have heard the formula has changed so I am not sure if I want to go that direction or not.

Avoderm- Dogs seem to like it but I am afraid that one manufacturing "slip" cound cause the skin to end up in the food. Not a good thing!


This is what I am starting to think. If it is healthy, my dogs either won't eat it OR the company has had what I feel are serious quality control issues with their plant.

Some of the foods that are deemed as the lowest nutrition have better quality control/less recall issues than some of the better food. *******I am starting to think that I am more apt to kill my dog with a recalled high nutrition product than a low nutrition product with a good quality control record. IE: I would rather take off two years of their life than 10...you know what I am trying to say? It feels like a real crap shoot.*****

I want good nutrition AND a safe product and something my dogs will actually eat. Any other suggestions for my junk food junkies? I am guessing that this is part of the reason some of you may have gone to feeding raw...but I am not quite ready for that...at least yet.


Sorry about the long read...it has been a long journey.

PS- Almost forgot, not a fan of the Diamond brand either.
 

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Ok, not to sound harsh, but your problems have NOTHING to do with food choices.....your problems are that your dogs are running the household. Since when does a dog tell a human what it will and won't eat? Um, not in my house. Myself and my boyfriend are in charge and they eat what is put in front of them or they don't eat....period. My dogs eat raw....and yup, I've had a few times that they've turned their nose up at a few things......and you know what I did?.....I gave them 15 minutes to eat it....and if they didn't, then I picked it up and put it back in the fridge....and I gave them the exact same thing for their next meal.......and low and behold, they ate it! Your dogs are just being ridiculously picky.....and you keep giving in by running and buying them something new. A healthy dog will not starve itself....so eventually the dog WILL eat it....and you are doing your dog a favor by feeding better quality food over any of the brands you said they actually like (purina, science death, etc). Be the leader of these dogs......they need you to be..... ;)
 

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3dogmom26 makes a good point. Chances are it isn't even that the dogs don't like what you're feeding them...it's just that it's new. While some dogs enjoy variety in their feedings, most dogs are creatures of habit and won't love changes of any kind immediately. If you pick a food and stick to it, your dogs will get used to it eventually.

My thought as I was reading is that you are worrying way too much. Seriously. Merrick's customer service? I've been feeding Merrick canned dog food on and off for a few years and have never even had a reason to talk to their customer service. Mold in dog food shipped directly to customers? It's exactly the same process as food shipped directly to pet stores. Why would yours have mold and their's not? I don't know where you heard high protein diets are bad for small dogs, but I've only ever heard the exact opposite...they are bad for large breed puppies because they cause faster growth, which can stress the joints. Dogs are carnivores. Why would a high protein diet be bad for them? As for the Avoderm, people seem to be feeding it reliably with no issues. Even if the toxic portion of the fruit made it into a batch, I can't seriously imagine that a small piece of avocado skin in a large vat of dog food would kill anyone's pet. Shoot, I had an Aussie who ate an entire chocolate cake off the counter and didn't even burp when he finished.

If you want to keep your dogs on Purina, then keep them on Purina. But I honestly think you're manufacturing reasons to freak yourself out.
 

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Dogs will not be any healthier on the so called "holistic" foods (what a joke, it's like Mc Donalds salty salad vs. their chicken - ALL kibble is processed, none are inherently better than another because of some stalk of herbal suplement or veggies thrown in). The best foods contain no veggies or supplements and are just meat/grain based. I did have a few dogs refuse to eat foods like Chicken Soup & Canidae, and if mine turn up their noses @ it, I take that seriously.

Dogs are not stupid, and not all food refusal can be attributed to picky eaters. If they are good eaters, then for seemingly no reason turn up their noses at a particular food, I pay attention to that. They may be smelling something I cannot, or may be having gastrointestinal problems from the food. However, it does sound like these dogs are just "food snobs", lol. And that's a behavior I don't tolerate with mine. Remember, they lick their rear ends, so a bit of kibble isn't going to hurt them. No food is perfect, but a good brand will take care of their quality control issues quickly. Don't overthink things too much, you'll just end up confusing yourself more than when you started. And the variety of kibbles are confusing enough as it is!

If they did well on Nutro, Purina or SD, I would stick with that. Mine do well on Purina & we have not noticed any quality issues at all with the feed. Now maybe the label doesn't read like Merricks but I couldn't care less. They're just dogs. They have a scavenger nature and can eat things that would make us deathly ill, such as raw meat :) Don't sweat the small stuff & just enjoy them as pets!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Ok, laughing here. I agree with most of the comments...but I have a dog granny who now lives with me and well, lets just say it adds a bit to it all. ( Yeah, I need more " backbone" in MY diet. :D)
I did read your replies to granny. :p

I also agree that they are overly spoiled, and that I am probably under enforcing the food, but like Urban Beagles pointed out, I think sometimes the dogs do know things we don't. (Such as maybe a food is too rich, or not right.) Then again if they made bug flavored dog food they would LOVE that. shrug.

My goal is to find the best possible food then enforce THAT food. Sounds good on paper anyway.


Honestly these dogs eat a lot better than I do. ( Value meals for mom.)

One other item I would love to hear your feelings on. I am till open minded to the grain free issue. Not that I think that grain is great for a dog, but really is a filler such as potato, (which is common in grain free dog food) that much better? I have heard that it can spike sugar levels and we don't have a lot of history with feeding it in dog food. Is this information true? Any thoughts/feedback?


Yes, I do spend WAY too much time on the Internet. But then again that is how I found out about recalls and nutrition issues.

Hmmmm haven't researched Fromm yet. :eek: and :)
 

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I agree with UrbanBeagle, too. And I can sympathize...I wanted to let you know that at one time I found myself getting too caught up in the "best dog food" dilemma.
I also worked in a great pet store that carries all the great (and some not so great) foods. So, I had access to alot of varieties. I subjected my dogs to almost every dog food out there trying to find the "magic bullet" dog food. And yes, I too spend alot of time "researching" on the internet. I found out there are multiple dog foods out there that my dogs do well on. I tried grain-free. Some of those worked, too. I finally decided to pick a decent, natural food that my dogs do well on and enjoy eating, I was happy with (ingredient-wise), had a good reputation as a company, and go for it. That food turned out to be Eagle Pack Holistic Select (dry and can). I decided they will stay on this food indefinitely. Or at least until it becomes necessary to change them for some reason (with necessary being the operative word here!). I hope that I don't have to. I've finally relaxed with the dog food dilemma and everythings back to normal for us! The dogs couldn't be happier, I'm sure LOL! So, I know somewhat what you're going through and I wish you good luck! :)
 

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Dogs will not be any healthier on the so called "holistic" foods (what a joke, it's like Mc Donalds salty salad vs. their chicken - ALL kibble is processed, none are inherently better than another because of some stalk of herbal suplement or veggies thrown in).
To be clear, many dogs are significantly healthier on the so called "holistic" foods. That doesn't mean a dog can't be healthy on something else, too, but it is misleading to say that all dog foods are the same.

The McDonald's analogy doesn't work in your favor because, just like with dog foods, there are items at McDonald's that are significantly better choices than others. You have to do your research.

To the OP, I still think you're overanalyzing. Perhaps you should try a raw diet for your dogs.
 

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One other item I would love to hear your feelings on. I am till open minded to the grain free issue. Not that I think that grain is great for a dog, but really is a filler such as potato, (which is common in grain free dog food) that much better? I have heard that it can spike sugar levels and we don't have a lot of history with feeding it in dog food. Is this information true? Any thoughts/feedback?

IMHO, the grain free feeds are EVIL :mad: I was thinking Wellness CORE was better considering the lowered levels of minerals (calcium, phoshhorous) but wow, was I ever wrong.

Yes, you are absolutely correct in that white potatoes do indeed spike the blood glucose levels. A tidbit of information I hadn't read up on until after two of my dogs had hypoglycemic seizures on CORE. Yup. Seizures. I have had some back problems on/off these past few months so was not running them much at all. So basically I had a pack of lazy hounds who weren't dropping their blood sugar with physical activity. We noticed straight away that they were becoming lethargic on CORE, and less than two weeks after starting it, along came the seizures. I am lucky neither dog went into a hypoglycemic coma and died b/c that can occur if the blood sugar drops low enough & and isn't brought back up quickly. Of course, I had no clue this was hypoglycemia (I haven't even had one go into a hypo fit in the field, much less have one from the stenuous activity of sitting on the couch) ... Anyway, blood sugar went from slightly under 40 to 89 about 4-5 weeks later on the low protein feed the Vet prescribed (oh yeah, they were drinking/urinating buckets and also had elevated BUN/cholesterol levels, too) which was none other than the evil Science Diet. Tell you the truth, that was an awesome food. A bit too pricy and was also making a few go grey in the face, but otherwise, one of the Top 5 feeds I've used.

The other grain frees are wildly ridiculous with the calcium : phosphorous ratio. Normal range should be around 1.1:1.0 ish. Evo has a ratio of about 2.0:3.0 ...

And yes again, potatoes, while they are not grains, are still a starch and still contribute carbs to the feed. Oatmeal, sweet potatoes, rice, even the much despised corn, contributes more nutritionally to the feed than potatoes.
When I fed Eukanuba, several of their Performance & small breed formulas were approx 26-28% carbs. That's about the same as EVO. Purina ONE, last time I checked, was about 30% carbs. And Abady, the feed I would probably try if I wasn't always so broke, with all it's meat by products and meat & bone meal, is 22% carbs. So there are other options for going lower carb. I find that many of the holistic feeds are the big offenders with starches, the highest I ever saw being the Foster & Smith feed @ 50% carbs - yikes :eek:
 

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My very health dog is on Orijen and we have no issue and the vet found him in fabulous health.

Royal Canin and Orijen have a lot of great information on their websites. Orijen says why they use potatoe on their "white paper". But everyone needs Carbs in their diets to have energy!

If the better quality kibble does not attract your dogs, try wetting it it will free the aroma. The thing is that Purina, Iams, Eukanuba, etc. usually coat their kibble with fat which makes it very attractive to dogs.

Do your research, reflect on it and then make the choice that seems best to you. For me it was Orijen, but for others it's Purina One... just follow you heart and your mind.
 

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I have to add when I took out the grain in my dogs food. The skin issues on my dogs cleared up. Just like humans alot of allergens are grains. I have seen amazing things when you take the grain out, I think it all depends on the dog.
 

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I prefer a raw diet but am far from a purist. Just decide on one food, whatever that may be based on what your dogs do well on, and feed it consistently.
 

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Another thing. You have small dogs. They don't need to eat much. My sister insisted her tiny dog eat two cans of dog food a day. She needed one can a day. Dog wanted to eat one can a day. Dog ate the two cans. Dog was a fat sausage. A while back I was very impressed that an agility papillon was fed all of 11 [some ridiculous number like that] kibble a day. I hope it was a larger kibble but still!

My two dogs are far healthier on raw and cooked food than kibble. Max did fine on kibble but there is a clear improvement on raw food. Sassy stinks less on cooked food than kibble. Her teeth are cleaner on the soft food than on crunchy kibble too. I will be feeding any future dogs real foods as well.

If you like, continue your research on feeding dogs. Have you found dogaware? B-Naturals? Loads of terrific information there on how to feed fresh cooked or raw food to your dogs.
 

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A while back I was very impressed that an agility papillon was fed all of 11 [some ridiculous number like that] kibble a day. I hope it was a larger kibble but still!
Haha! My mom said she wanted a tiny dog, and I told her that instead of measuring the dog's food, she'd have to count it out...."7, 8, 9! There ya go!" I didn't know people actually did that, I was just joking.

But yeah, most people do overfeed their small dogs, and it's sad to see them pressuring the dog to eat when the dog clearly knows how much he/she needs to be healthy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
So what does everyone think a good % of carbs would be for two small dogs. House dogs, normaly puppy play, mostly couch potato's?
 

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Has anyone considered maybe adding some fish oil to the dry kibble? Maybe that will entice the dog to eat the healthier food?
 

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I completely relate to you, I have two greyhounds and they are sooo fussy its unbelievable, at one pint they pratically went on hunger strike. They seemed to eat the same food for a couple of days running and then turn their nose up. I'd about given up hope until i decided to try a brand called Vitalin, they both love it :) from the reviews and the packet its meant to be really good for them too and i've noticed their breaths don't smell as bad which is always a bonus. I get the complete dog food from Luxury Pet Store.co.uk . It's only £26.50 for a 15kg bag which seems to last forever. I'm very pleased as I thought i'd have to shell out loads buying them the most luxurious food out there. You should definitely give it a go.
 
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