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Discussion Starter #1
Thank you so much for reading this. Let me start off by telling you what happened. My wife and I met 5 years ago. She had two dogs and I had one. They became an instant pack after my little buddy peed on her bed the first visit to her house. They were stuck from then on. About two years ago we moved to a new house a built a big huge privacy fence for the dogs to run and play. Never had any problems from the three, a beagle mix(male), Australian Shepard mix(female), and lab/chow mix(female). About six months ago we added a new member of our pack a 1-year-old boxer mix(female). We only had one incident where it looked as if the lab mix(Sadie) got into a fight with the boxer mix(tela) in a kennel one day. That was when we first got her and never had any problems since. Then our world came crashing down 2 days ago when my wife had went shopping and left the dogs outside. When she returned home she found our baby girl(Sadie) had been killed and partially eaten on her leg. Tela(boxer mix) and André(beagle mix) both had blood on them and puncture wounds. I could understand if tela had killed her but why did they kill her and why would andre her old friend help? We think she might have been sick, could they have done a mercy killing? I could get rid of the new dog but I really don't know what to do about Andre my dog before the relationship. How do I trust them ever again and how do we become a stable pack again. Thank you so much for any help, we are just at a loss at how this could have happened. Ours live have turned upside down. R.I.P Sadie" my precious baby"
Eric Coomes
Tore to pieces
 

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I'm so sorry for your lost but this is why NO DOGS NO MATTER WHAT BREED need to be kept apart when the Humans are gone. They are just dogs following their instincts.

Pack dinamics are different then just one dog. A pack of dogs feed off of eachother energy. If one gets overly excited they all do. If the leader of the pack decides they want to kill or hunt, the pack joins in. Doesn't matter if it's an old "friend" or a child. Packs act differently then just a single dog would.

Without seeing what actually happened, I really couldn't tell you why it happened. Too keep it from happening again, separate your pack when you are gone.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Thats what we have discussed. We just really want to know why after being together so long Andre would have done that. I understand the new girl. I just hope he was just trying to protect her. I now am having a hard time showing them any affection and that breaks my heart as well.

Thanks for all the support. Just wished I could have been there, to stop or at least know what happened
 

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Don't leave the dogs together unsupervised and that should solve your problem.
Agreed. But in addition you need to spend time training the dogs separately and spending time with each dog one on one working on obedience and using nilif.

Now that would not have helped in this situation when you were gone. The fact is you already had two bitches, which luckily was working out well. You then introduced a third bitch into the pack. My guess is you then ended up with two very dominant bitches. You already had one fight while the dogs were unsupervised but then things seemed to go well. But, eventually those two were going to go at it again and, unlike most dog fights, bitch fights are rarely about pack position and are much much more serious than dog fights. As to why the others joined in, probably just because they are predators and that's what a dog or wolf pack will do. As much as we love them dogs are animals and react as such.

I'm terribly sorry this happened but as already stated. keep the dogs separated when not closely supervised.
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
This is all a big help. I figured Andre probably just got caught up in it. Just needed some reinforcement. Thanks. By the way what is nilif?

I don't want to put anyone down. This being an unsupervised incident and isolated, should I be worried in the future aslong as no unsupervised playing?
 

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This being an unsupervised incident and isolated, should I be worried in the future aslong as no unsupervised playing?

Worried? No. But, even in really stable relationships bickering can escalate in a flash even if you're standing there. I've had 3 plus dogs and the tension seems to be much higher than with just two. Others here have multiple dogs and I'm sure they'll lend their views/experience.
 

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People I know with multiple dog households, rotate the dogs and don't permit certain ones out together. Plus they work hard at getting absolute obedience from their dogs. This means when they say "sit" the dogs sit and don't move until given the ok. It also means they can put the dogs in long (30 minute +) downs at any time, and under any circumstances and the dogs will instantly obey. That level of control and training takes time and effort to achieve but it can be done. And the place to start is with obedience lessons, and both group and private lessons would be a good idea.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thank you all. I thought our dogs were trained pretty good, but I now see we need more work. After speaking to you all I now feel better about keeping them and not putting anyone to sleep. I am totally COMMITTED to my other babies and I guess dogs will be dogs.
 

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Realize that when you are gone all training goes out the window. Dogs left unattended are free spirits. The tricky part is there are some dogs left alone never get into fights/spats etc. But as you found out sometimes disaster strikes. Sorry for your loss. I mentioned the training aspect because some owners would get a false impression that if they do all the training in the world their dogs would be safe when left alone. It just doesn't work like that. Do not beat yourself up as sometimes in life bad things just happen.
 

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The others have posted good advice--as they've said, I would definitely not leave the dogs together when you're gone.

I just wanted to say I'm sorry for your loss.
 

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I now have 3 dogs Gypsy 3.5 yr old spayed female, Cash 2 yr old intact male and now the new puppy, I would never leave them alone unsupervised, I keep my dogs in crates while Im away or asleep, some find that cruel, I do not, I have even left doors to the crates open and they sleep there.. We had a mauling 2 yrs this September of 2 people by 4 American Bulldog/mixes possibly inbred as well, they attacked and mauled a 96 yr old man in his yard ripped him apart then a lady on her daily walk, tore 1 leg off (sorry so graphic) The owner ended up with almost 5 yrs in prison because she neglected them and they bit in the past... See only 1 of the dog was aggressive, she started it and then the other 3 had that pack mentality kick in and they contributed to the mauling, the familes want BSL where you can only own 1 aggressive breed, I did meet the husband of the woman and he was a nice man and we talked about dogs, I think i made him understand a bit better about a dogs state of mind...

What could have happened with your dogs is a little scuffle turned large and the other dog joined in so then it was 2 on 1 and the poor dog that passed didnt have a chance, sorry for your loss, please keep your dogs seperated when you are away and cant break up fights if they occur, which in most households with more then 1 dog it will happen but usually not as severe as death..
 

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The worst fights I've ever seen/heard about have been between female dogs (especially if they both aren't spayed.).

I had 2 females that NEVER fought, but one was VERY submissive to all dogs. I have 3 dogs now (2 neutered males/1 spayed female) that all get along very well, with NO fights, and are left together unsupervised whenever I leave the house. But I KNOW that they won't fight (none are food aggressive/do resource guarding/ or territorial).

After the first fight, they should never have been left together unsupervised.

I'd bet that with the other dog gone, you will be back to a harmonious household.
 

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But I KNOW that they won't fight
No you don't. Anything is possible, and sometimes its better to be safe than sorry. It doesn't matter if when your there they don't fight. Things can change when you leave, maybe the play gets a little too rough, or one just decides this is my bone and you can't have it
 

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Firstly let me extend my deepest condolences to your situation...that's very horrid.

As a pack leader to 5 dog for of which are large breed and 1 of which has a very abusive history I can say that I never leave my dogs unattended if they are together, especially if both the bitches are together.
A pack is a very fluid concept and is constantly changing dynamics. And when you (the pack leader) is gone, your dogs still need someone to follow whilst you are not there and so the most dominant dog will take that place. If there is more than one dominant dog in your pack eg your labXchow and boxer (both powerful breeds by nature) they will by instinct fight it out. dogs don't live in the past with a "you're my friend" attitude dogs are a survival based species with a "what's best for the pack" attitude, friends just doesn't cut it and it doesn't matter if they are domestic or wild their mental processing is still the same and there is the basic instinct hard wired into their psyche. When I am away all my dogs are housed separately, i know for a fact that any one of them could turn on each other at any time and have witnessed even with my supervision quite violent attacks between so called buddies...I'm sorry to say but when owning multiple dogs this is something that must be done to ensure their safety.

MANGO HOLY COW, that's just insane
 

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If dogs are capable of so much violence, then there is not a good reason to leave them unsupervised together. Can you provide evidence that living together creates healthy dogs?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Thanks for all the support. This has helped me gain the trust of my dogs in the short time of this forum. There is still alot of work to be done, but we'll be fine. Has this ever happended to anyone else?
 

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Thanks for all the support. This has helped me gain the trust of my dogs in the short time of this forum. There is still alot of work to be done, but we'll be fine. Has this ever happended to anyone else?

yes. not to me. but to two different people I know.

one involved two Westies, a Min Pin and a chihuahua. the chi was the victim.

the other involved several large mutts.
 
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