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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all.
I'm looking for a overall good family dog thats good with children.
Looking for easy to train dog , good watchdog.
Will take the dog to the groomer so either breeds won't bother me. They both don't shed!

I figured maybe the standard would be better cause they taller and good watchdog then the poodle. Dont made taking both dogs to doggy daycare to burn off there energy.

Any ideas suggestions?
Looking for a eager to please dog.
Not looking for the standard poodle due to size and weight.

Is the wiry hair on the schnauzer easier to brush then the mini poodle hair?
 

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  • Height: 18.5-19.5 inches (male), 17.5-18.5 inches (female)
  • Weight: 35-50 pounds (male), 30-45 pounds (female)
Standard Schnauzer ^^
  • Height: Over 15 inches (standard)
  • Weight: 60-70 pounds (male), 40-50 pounds (female)
Standard Poodle ^^
  • Height: 10-15 inches
  • Weight: 10-15 pounds
Miniature Poodle ^^

There isn't that much size difference between a small SPoo and a Standard Schnauzer as there is between MiniPoo and the Standard Schnauzer. There is, however, quite a bit of difference in personality between either Poodle variety and the Schnauzer.

One thing to keep in mind is that MiniPoos are a bit more delicate than either of the other two, and might not be suitable for rough and tumble play with younger children.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
  • Height: 18.5-19.5 inches (male), 17.5-18.5 inches (female)
  • Weight: 35-50 pounds (male), 30-45 pounds (female)
Standard Schnauzer ^^
  • Height: Over 15 inches (standard)
  • Weight: 60-70 pounds (male), 40-50 pounds (female)
Standard Poodle ^^
  • Height: 10-15 inches
  • Weight: 10-15 pounds
Miniature Poodle ^^

There isn't that much size difference between a small SPoo and a Standard Schnauzer as there is between MiniPoo and the Standard Schnauzer. There is, however, quite a bit of difference in personality between either Poodle variety and the Schnauzer.

One thing to keep in mind is that MiniPoos are a bit more delicate than either of the other two, and might not be suitable for rough and tumble play with younger children.
Maybe the mini poodles will be easier to manage and train because they like to please and people with their people vs the standard schnauzer having a more stubborn or independent mind?
 

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It's a bummer that there aren't medium poodles (otherwise known as moyen, klein, mellom...) well established in the US. They fall between mini and standard poodles, and are a brilliant size for a small dog who's a bit bigger and sturdier than the minis. Sadly, there's very few reputable breeders of them in the US, because it's not a size recognized by the American Kennel Club or the United Kennel Club (though many reputable European kennel clubs do recognize it).

Poodles are in general very people-focused and eager to work with you. They're considered easy to train, but keep in mind that intelligence also means that they're good at learning things you don't mean to teach them, too... like how if they bark or paw at you you give them attention (any attention is good attention to many dog). Or how your jacket pockets sometimes have stray dog treats to root out. Or how to open the sliding glass door to the backyard. They do need to be kept mentally stimulated so they don't get in too much trouble.

Mine is a pretty good alert barker when he thinks something weird or exciting is going on. Height really doesn't make a big difference, imo - if they can't see the thing, they can hear it. My poodle always knew exactly when it was my wife coming up the stairs to our first apartment's door, despite being in a communal building with other people going up and down regularly.

Plenty of poodles make good family dogs, although it is important that you're aware that minis can be delicate and kids can't roughhouse or manhandle them. Definitely look for a breeder who is breeding dogs that are thriving in family setting and have a temperament and energy you enjoy. Even if the breeder is very excellent and reputable and producing wonderful, healthy dogs, it's a bad match if most of their dogs are going to competitive sports homes because they're high energy, intense, and need lots of exercise and stimulation.

But keep in mind that some dogs - even great dogs - don't do well in doggy daycare or dog park situations. They can be very chaotic and high-energy, and overwhelming for some dogs. My own poodle is a very poor fit for this kind of dog-dog interaction, and trying to force these interactions on him has made him very insecure and snappy around strange dogs. A dog walker who handles a single dog at a time is a better fit for most dogs if you need some extra help with exercise!
 

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Discussion Starter #5
It's a bummer that there aren't medium poodles (otherwise known as moyen, klein, mellom...) well established in the US. They fall between mini and standard poodles, and are a brilliant size for a small dog who's a bit bigger and sturdier than the minis. Sadly, there's very few reputable breeders of them in the US, because it's not a size recognized by the American Kennel Club or the United Kennel Club (though many reputable European kennel clubs do recognize it).

Poodles are in general very people-focused and eager to work with you. They're considered easy to train, but keep in mind that intelligence also means that they're good at learning things you don't mean to teach them, too... like how if they bark or paw at you you give them attention (any attention is good attention to many dog). Or how your jacket pockets sometimes have stray dog treats to root out. Or how to open the sliding glass door to the backyard. They do need to be kept mentally stimulated so they don't get in too much trouble.

Mine is a pretty good alert barker when he thinks something weird or exciting is going on. Height really doesn't make a big difference, imo - if they can't see the thing, they can hear it. My poodle always knew exactly when it was my wife coming up the stairs to our first apartment's door, despite being in a communal building with other people going up and down regularly.

Plenty of poodles make good family dogs, although it is important that you're aware that minis can be delicate and kids can't roughhouse or manhandle them. Definitely look for a breeder who is breeding dogs that are thriving in family setting and have a temperament and energy you enjoy. Even if the breeder is very excellent and reputable and producing wonderful, healthy dogs, it's a bad match if most of their dogs are going to competitive sports homes because they're high energy, intense, and need lots of exercise and stimulation.

But keep in mind that some dogs - even great dogs - don't do well in doggy daycare or dog park situations. They can be very chaotic and high-energy, and overwhelming for some dogs. My own poodle is a very poor fit for this kind of dog-dog interaction, and trying to force these interactions on him has made him very insecure and snappy around strange dogs. A dog walker who handles a single dog at a time is a better fit for most dogs if you need some extra help with exercise!
I was thinking of the moyen.
I found a breeder that will have pups soon in a few months. The poodle will be 20 pounds max which isn't bad comparing to the standard poodle.
 

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If it's a reputable breeder doing full genetic health testing on the parents and breeding from moyen stocks (not mixing standard poodles with minis or toys to make them smaller), that can be a great option. Just know that some less reputable breeders are mixing sizes together and calling them 'moyen' poodles, even though mixing sizes can be much less predictable - the puppies might wind up the size of a standard or barely bigger than a mini - and the different sizes of poodles have different health issues that still need to be checked for and evaluated with each breeding.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
If it's a reputable breeder doing full genetic health testing on the parents and breeding from moyen stocks (not mixing standard poodles with minis or toys to make them smaller), that can be a great option. Just know that some less reputable breeders are mixing sizes together and calling them 'moyen' poodles, even though mixing sizes can be much less predictable - the puppies might wind up the size of a standard or barely bigger than a mini - and the different sizes of poodles have different health issues that still need to be checked for and evaluated with each breeding.
Yes I saw mini and standard mixing. I figured its better to get a mini where both parents are same weight
 

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Yes, a genuine moyen line would have moyen-sized dogs - who have been bred to be that size for generation after generation - imported from countries where this size is recognized. Preferably after having already been shown to championship so that the breeder has an outside source that confirms that the dog physically meets the breed standard. If it's just a standard bred to mini, they're just using the term 'moyen' as a sketchy marketing ploy - steer clear.

Your best bet is a mini, since you'll be able to find many more breeders and be able to pick which one is producing dogs that fit you and your family's needs. I'd start with The Poodle Club of America.
 

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Yes, a genuine moyen line would have moyen-sized dogs - who have been bred to be that size for generation after generation - imported from countries where this size is recognized. Preferably after having already been shown to championship so that the breeder has an outside source that confirms that the dog physically meets the breed standard. If it's just a standard bred to mini, they're just using the term 'moyen' as a sketchy marketing ploy - steer clear.

Your best bet is a mini, since you'll be able to find many more breeders and be able to pick which one is producing dogs that fit you and your family's needs. I'd start with The Poodle Club of America.
Hard to find moyen in the USA. Like both mom and dad are moyen and pups are moyens
 

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Yes, there's very few. Like I said, that's because breeders would have to import pretty much all their breeding dogs, and travel if they want to show any puppies they produce and continue their lines. So it's very expensive, even more so than regular dog breeding. I hope the size is recognized in the US some day, it's a lovely in-between where they're still small dogs, but not too tiny or delicate.
 

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I know of a reputable breeders of Moyens in the U.S.

- Karbit poodles (under Small Standard/Kleinpudel puppies) Located in Texas.

- Located in Missouri

Minature poodles are rather delicate, but there are some heavier bones ones out there. They are very sensitve dogs, but they are very smart, and eager to please. They are barkers, and will probably bark at the door. I may be bias, but the bad outweighs the good and I do think Poodles are one of the best dog breeds out there. Well rounded, obedient etc.

Schnauzer's I think require hand stripping? Which isn't as easy to do at home as it is to take a clipper to your poodle, They are heavier boned than MOST MP's which makes them less risky with children possibly getting too rough with your dog.

Schnauzers probably weigh more, but they are very similar in height. 11" is the smallest a MP should be, but they can be smaller. Same goes for Schnauzer's though, any breed can be over or below height standards.

I think a Moyen would be the perfect happy medium, I am personally on a Search for a 15"-20" poodle, and I can't find any anywhere. It will be hard to find a reputable breeder of small poodles. less hard to find a reputable breeder of minis who has a Mini Standard Spoo sized.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I know of a reputable breeders of Moyens in the U.S.

- Karbit poodles (under Small Standard/Kleinpudel puppies) Located in Texas.

- Located in Missouri

Minature poodles are rather delicate, but there are some heavier bones ones out there. They are very sensitve dogs, but they are very smart, and eager to please. They are barkers, and will probably bark at the door. I may be bias, but the bad outweighs the good and I do think Poodles are one of the best dog breeds out there. Well rounded, obedient etc.

Schnauzer's I think require hand stripping? Which isn't as easy to do at home as it is to take a clipper to your poodle, They are heavier boned than MOST MP's which makes them less risky with children possibly getting too rough with your dog.

Schnauzers probably weigh more, but they are very similar in height. 11" is the smallest a MP should be, but they can be smaller. Same goes for Schnauzer's though, any breed can be over or below height standards.

I think a Moyen would be the perfect happy medium, I am personally on a Search for a 15"-20" poodle, and I can't find any anywhere. It will be hard to find a reputable breeder of small poodles. less hard to find a reputable breeder of minis who has a Mini Standard Spoo sized.
If I would get a standard or mini schnauzer I would take him to the groomer.
I'm trying to see if brushing the poodle with its curly hair is easier to do then the wiry fur of the schnauzer
 

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Depends on how long you want the coat. If you want to keep a poodle in a long, fluffy coat, it's going to be quite a lot of work regularly brushing and combing it between groomer visits to keep it free from nasty, potentially painful mats. Daily, if possible. If you want to keep them clipped quite short, they will need to go to the groomer more often, but their coats are much easier to handle. This is an example of my poodle several years ago in a very short, manageable coat - I rarely have to do more than a quick brush at this length, except for his fluffy tail:



Schnauzers can also be kept in longer or shorter trims, but I believe they have somewhat more manageable coats than poodles as adults. I have not owned a schnauzer myself, however, so I can't be certain.
 

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If I would get a standard or mini schnauzer I would take him to the groomer.
I'm trying to see if brushing the poodle with its curly hair is easier to do then the wiry fur of the schnauzer
My mini schnauzers were all 14" in height, one was oversized at 15". You do not HAVE to strip the coat, but it does prevent the undercoat from taking over. This coat is soft, not weather resistant and duller in appearance. But I didn't start stripping hair until I got my pup in Sept so it's really no issue for a home pet to be clippered, they just might get more cold in the weather and the coat is not waterproof, so these schnauzers would be less tolerant of getting wet. When I used to take my minis to the groomer, it would be every 3 months. By two months the hair is growing longer already, so I did a bit of touching up in beteeen. But if you keep up with brushing everyday, it just takes a quick comb and no knots. I use a brush with rotating teeth to comb the furnishings, the jacket doesn't really get messed up since it's usually kept short.

One thing I wish I did for my other mini's jackets is carding. I use a stripping knife to card (hold the knife flat against skin and comb). It really helps remove the dead hair and keeps the hair free of tangles. Honestly my pup likes to be carded and lies right down.

Btw, schnauzers have a double coat, that's why there is an undercoat and wire coat, whereas I believe poodles have one coat, so wouldn't have to be hand stripped. Honestly though I found hand stripping to be a lot easier than I was led to believe and I self taught myself online.

I am bias toward mini schnauzers, but I do recommend them for a household with children. I don't have any, but I had a mini schnauzer as a teen and my minis all love children and are very good with them. They are generally are (any dog can be not trained properly) great with children and def can handle a bit of rough handling, they are not delicate dogs for their size. They are very strong for a smaller dog. They are super intelligent, high energy (LOVE to play), use their brains (LOVE lots of mental stimulation), love to please you and loyal.

I am only speaking about the mini schnauzer as I have never had a standard and personality traits differ a bit. But honestly after having 3 of my own, I don't think I could handle more schnauzer or would want to, the mini is all I need.
 

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Hello all.
I'm looking for a overall good family dog thats good with children.
Looking for easy to train dog , good watchdog.
Will take the dog to the groomer so either breeds won't bother me. They both don't shed!

I figured maybe the standard would be better cause they taller and good watchdog then the poodle. Dont made taking both dogs to doggy daycare to burn off there energy.

Any ideas suggestions?
Looking for a eager to please dog.
Not looking for the standard poodle due to size and weight.

Is the wiry hair on the schnauzer easier to brush then the mini poodle hair?
Black mouth cur and Catahoula leopard dog also called catahoula cut . Both breeds are excellent all around family breeds . I have 2 a mix of the two breeds supper intelligent and can have ears and tails pulled on and they roll over for more
 

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I can honestly recommend a true reliable breeder of Moyan down to Miniature sized Poodles in Ohio. She has been in business for over 30 years. All parents are health tested and puppies come with guarantees. She takes deposits and you need to be on a waiting list. Call her and talk to her. I have personally been there twice to get my two puppies. Her kennel is spotless and the parents are on site! She will ship if needed. Her name is Cathy She is extremely knowledgeable as well ... Windy Hill Kennel
 

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I can honestly recommend a true reliable breeder of Moyan down to Miniature sized Poodles in Ohio. She has been in business for over 30 years. All parents are health tested and puppies come with guarantees. She takes deposits and you need to be on a waiting list. Call her and talk to her. I have personally been there twice to get my two puppies. Her kennel is spotless and the parents are on site! She will ship if needed. Her name is Cathy She is extremely knowledgeable as well ... Windy Hill Kennel
I looked at their website, and saw so many thins that turned me off... Merle Poodles and parti-color and merle Miniature schnauzers aren't my idea of a good breeder Also, seventeen bitches and eight males (nine counting one "retired"), ordering a puppy by breed, dam, and microchip number don't say good breeder to me. Absolutely no information on health testing for any of their breeding dogs. It looks like all the dogs live in kennels. NuVet vitamins are a MLM scheme.
 
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NOPE I already linked two reputable breeders of moyens, DO NOT buy from that kennel :L
 

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Merle poodles and schnauzers aren't purebred. I don't actually have a quibble with thoughtful outcrossing, but if someone tries to register merle dogs, they're lying about something in the dog's lineage. It's simply not possible for a merle dog to arise from a poodle/poodle or a schnauzer/schnauzer breeding. And introducing the merle to the poodle gene pool brought along a bunch of health risks purebred poodles don't have (probably the same with schnauzers...I'm just more familiar with it in poodles because I researched before getting my hairball). It's the worst kind of "designer dog" BS...making dogs LESS healthy just to get trendy-looking pups to sell for more money.
 
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