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Discussion Starter #1
I was feeding Odin 2 cups a day of Nature's Variety Instinct. He was pooping 4-5 times a day. Even though they were solid that was an increase over his crappy food (Purina One). It was suggested that I was feeding him too much and to cut back. I decreased it to a cup and a half. I took him to the vet today for a broken tooth and the vet asked about what he was eating. I explained everything to him and he told me I was under feeding him and not to feed him less than 2 and a half cups a day. I guess I will just have to keep scooping a lot of food but I feel like he is crapping away my money.
 

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That is ridiculous! There is no way a given amount of food is THE correct amount. Put your hands on your pup and feed more if his ribs are too bumpy under your hands and less if you cannot feel them easily.d

If those piles are soft and loose and he is ribby then try increasing the number of meals each day. Sassy taught me that. She just pooped out extra food when I tried to fatten her up and later she showed me she could eat more food per day if I added in meals but couldn't eat larger meals.
 

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Don't listen to your vet... Vets aren't qualified in nutrition and I think you're feeding your dog just fine. Especially with a good quality food... But most vets can't tell the difference between Orijen and Purina and would be more likely to recommend the Purina. The only way you are underfeeding your dog is if you can see the ribs/spine/hip bones without feeling for them/squinting.
 

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Vets are often underinformed regarding nutrition and what constitutes a good food - most sell a grain heavy brand (Hills, Royal Canin, Purina Vet, etc.) and are used to the amounts that have to be fed for those foods. You don't have to feed as much of a grain free food. The loose and frequent poo is usually a clear indicator of overfeeding when it's a nutrient dense food, such as Instinct. If your dog is pooping all the time (esp. if it's soft), he's not retaining the proper nutrients; the food's going through his system too fast. If you cut back, his stomach will settle down and he'll retain the needed nutrients. It might take awhile, b/c his stomach is distressed right now. If, after a couple of weeks he's not any better, you could try one of the other variteties and see if that helps. He might end up being sensitive to the protein source in the current one. I wouldn't hasten to change too fast though, unless he continues to get worse and worse - give it a few weeks.

You could give him a probiotic to help temporarily. I gave a sensitive stomach boxer pup I used to have an acidolpholus tablet every day in his food (you can disguise it in pnut butter) - I got the human grade kind that had to be refrigerated once opened. You can also put a spoonful of plain pumpkin (NOT pie filling) in his food (the fiber helps firm things up).

I agree with Kathyy: feel your dog's spine and ribs to gage whether or not you're feeding him enough.
 

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Don't listen to your vet... Vets aren't qualified in nutrition and I think you're feeding your dog just fine. Especially with a good quality food... But most vets can't tell the difference between Orijen and Purina and would be more likely to recommend the Purina. The only way you are underfeeding your dog is if you can see the ribs/spine/hip bones without feeling for them/squinting.
Umn, if you haven't had your hands on the pup, how can you say with any certainty thatr she's "feeding the dog just fine." I don't generally go to the vet for nutritional advice, but I've found that my vets, at least, are are pretty cognazant of body condition. Without seeing the puppy, I couldn't say if the puppy is getting the correct amount of calories.
 

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Umn, if you haven't had your hands on the pup, how can you say with any certainty thatr she's "feeding the dog just fine." I don't generally go to the vet for nutritional advice, but I've found that my vets, at least, are are pretty cognazant of body condition. Without seeing the puppy, I couldn't say if the puppy is getting the correct amount of calories.
I assumed that the dog wasn't looking emaciated or anything and the vet was just going off what she said she was feeding, not the dog's appearance or weight. My mistake.
 

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When I got Sydney as a pup the vet told me to put a large amount of measured food out and let her eat all she wanted, then measure what was left for a few days until I could put out as much food as she would eat, but no more. The first few days she ate like a pig and her little belly was so puffed up! Eventually she regulated herself and was eating about 1.5 cups 3x a day. I honestly thing we underfed Chloe when she was a pup because she never even got close to that amount, but she was out first puppy and she has turned out fine and fit these days.

I know I was hurt when the vet said I was underfeeding my puppy, but she did look better when I started feeding her more. I think we were feeding 4health puppy at that point, or something similar.
 

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I'd go by what the dog looks like and feels like. Can you post some pictures?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Sorry I haven't responded. Odin was neutered today and I have been dealing with all of that. The vet says he looks okay right now but if I don't increase his intake he will not stay that way. I guess it would be better to feed him more as the vet is requesting and cut back if he gains too quickly. Thank you all for the help you have given both Odin and me.
 

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You feed less of higher quality food, that's the way it works! Foods like Purina that are full of corn have a lot of undigestible matter in them that gets passed right on through, which is why you have to feed more. Don't listen to the vet. Follow the feeding guidelines on the bag and adjust as needed. If the puppy looks a good weight, he's fine. It's completely ridiculous to say a puppy on any food needs a certain amount.. each food and each puppy is different.
 

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Who suggested that you cut back his food? I think you need to seriously reconsider your vet or dog trainer, whoever gave you that information. Also, vets, dog trainers, and other animal specialists have no expertise in dog nutrition. Most of their education about nutrition comes from paid advertisements by commercial brands, and many vets suggest that Beneful and Purina are the best brands of dog food, despite the fact that the first ingredients are meal and corn. I'm not sure how long you've been feeding him on this brand, but dogs can experience some changes and upset in their digestion system when they are transitioning food, especially if you choose to do a rapid switch as opposed to replacing the food gradually. I feed my puppy Nature's Instinct Raw, and the feeding guidelines suggested 3 cups per day for a 50 pound, 8-month-old puppy. It was the exact same amount that I was feeding in dry kibble, except that according to the feeding suggestions for Taste of the Wild Dry Kibble, I was grossly overfeeding my dog. This was despite the fact that he was thinning out, losing hair, and had a poor rate of growth. You can check out the feeding calculator for Nature's Instinct right here: http://www.naturesvariety.com/feedguide. It is the feeding guidelines recommended by the actual company that makes the food.
 

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It may be enough, but if you dont mind me asking, exactly which kind of natures variety instinct are you feeding? I want to break it down in terms of kcal. Also how old is the pup and what breed?

We have a 5 month old Siberian. He is fed:

Morning 1 c. of Blue Wilderness Salmon/Duck or Acana Wild Prairie

Evening 1 1/4 c. of Grandma Lucy's Pureformance Chicken.

Before we added the freezed dried, Cato was 10 weeks and was getting 1 c. of Acana 3x a day.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Odin is a 4 month lab mix (mixed with I don't know). I am currently feeding him Nature's Instinct Chicken meal. He gets 1 and 1/4 cup in the morning and 1 and 1/4 in the evening. So that would be 2 1/2 cups daily. He is getting more loose stools since the increase (he was getting 1 1/2 cups before). I a, wondering if that might be from his recent neutering. I will keep an eye on that. I wish that I could just find an amount and stick with it.
 

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I took my dog for an emergency visit to a new vet ... who told me I had to feed her more, that she was too thin. Two days later I started a conditioning class with a 'dog sports' vet who had a rehab clinic in town. She pointed out to all the other people in the class that the only dog not seriously over weight was mine ... even though mine could stand loosing a pound or two too. "normal" vets are so used seeing over weight dogs that that has become the norm.
 

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He is getting more loose stools since the increase (he was getting 1 1/2 cups before). I a, wondering if that might be from his recent neutering. I will keep an eye on that. I wish that I could just find an amount and stick with it.
The increased loose stools with the kibble increase proves what some of us have been telling you. Too much of a rich food will cause loose stools. I'd cut back to a cup in the a.m. and 1 1/4 c. in the evening, and see if that helps (total of 1 1/4 c. daily). You'll have to experiment to find the "right" amount for your dog. If you're over feeding and it's all going out the other end anyway, what's the point? If you're feeding the correct amount, then the dog's body will absorb the necessary nutrients and thrive.

I don't think the loose stools are from the neutering.
 

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When I got Sydney as a pup the vet told me to put a large amount of measured food out and let her eat all she wanted, then measure what was left for a few days until I could put out as much food as she would eat, but no more. The first few days she ate like a pig and her little belly was so puffed up! Eventually she regulated herself and was eating about 1.5 cups 3x a day. <snip>
That did not work at all with little miss fatty ... she ate herself to oblivion ... and kept eating until it all was gone no matter what. (This is the dog that ate at least 20 cups horse feed when hubby left it on the ground ... and we had to make an emergency visit to the vet.) Not all dogs will regulate what they need, some have a 'fatty gene' or something and would LIKE to be fat. LOL
 

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I feed my puppy Nature's Instinct Raw, and the feeding guidelines suggested 3 cups per day for a 50 pound, 8-month-old puppy. It was the exact same amount that I was feeding in dry kibble, except that according to the feeding suggestions for Taste of the Wild Dry Kibble, I was grossly overfeeding my dog. This was despite the fact that he was thinning out, losing hair, and had a poor rate of growth. You can check out the feeding calculator for Nature's Instinct right here: http://www.naturesvariety.com/feedguide. It is the feeding guidelines recommended by the actual company that makes the food.
I'm confused....You're feeding Nature's Variety Instinct Raw and the feeding guidelines were in cups? Their raw is in medallions, patties, maybe chubs, can't remember, that you feed in ounces or pounds, not cups.
 

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"normal" vets are so used seeing over weight dogs that that has become the norm.
I think this could be true for a lot of vets (and human doctors!). It's become easier to overlook that extra 5 lbs on a dog's frame because that's mostly what they see walk in the door all the time.
 

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The loose stools are more than likely from the neuter. Often times, in fact more often than not, loose stools are brought on my the anesthesia used during the neuter. I would wait at least 72 hours before you would notice solid stools. Honestly, I think you are feeding the perfect amount for now. If the pup isn't hungry then don't worry about it. BTW, vets aren't completely ignorant, and a lot are getting significantly more educated about food recently. Does your vet know you are on the nature's variety raw? Did he give you scrutiny because of the "raw" int he title? Just a few questions I am concerned about.
 
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