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So when i switched Shadow to Canidae I was going to go grain free but the lady at the store told me that since he is a puppy we should go with the All Life Stages formula instead because as a puppy he needs the grain nutrients. So I bought the All Life Stages and decided to wait for grain free till he is about a year old (He is about 13-14 weeks now). Was the lady at the store correct? What's the benefits of grain free? Are there benefits of not going grain free?
 

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Where did you buy your food? It is very common for sales associates to recommend something they have in the store so you buy it. The first time I went to a petstore I was recommended Science Diet, which most of us believe is horrible.

I'm a little biased, but our pup was started on Pedigree and Purina mix. Both grain/filler filled foods. We switched him to Orijen Puppy - Our advantages have been more energy, way better coat (It was dull and harsh initially, now its soft, smooth, and shiny), generally happier, less gas, solid poops.

Some experts believe dogs are not made to digest grains as they are carnivores, therefore, people like me believe grain-free is the way to go since its made up mostly of meat. However, grain-free tends to sometimes give dogs really runny stool, and is not meant for every dog.

So grain foods do have their place and some dogs do really well on them. At the end of the day, its up to your dog and his digestive system.

Going back to Canidae, its a high quality food regardless of the grain or grain-free. I really wouldn't worry about it too much at this point in time. Whats really important is how your puppy will react to your food and if he will even like it. Watch his poops/energy levels/coat... if everything is the way you want it, you found a winner.
 

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There is never a time that any dog needs grain in his diet. It contributes nothing to the dog nutritionly. Grain is nothing more than a filler.
 

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There is never a time that any dog needs grain in his diet. It contributes nothing to the dog nutritionly. Grain is nothing more than a filler.
How about the potato in grain-free foods?? I don't think that's much better, and can be worse for some dogs.
 

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Animals need carbs don't they? there's probably less potato in grain free than grains in normal kibble. I really don't understand this animosity against potato since it's such a nourishing vegetable?

I'm not trying to be a smart *$$ I'm just really confused :confused:
 

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Carnivores have no nutritional need for carbs. They utilize fats in the same way we utilize carbs in our bodies. Potatoes are not nurishing to a dog and they have a lot of startch. They are used to stick the kibbles together the same way grains do. If you take the grain out of kibble you have to put a "sticking agent" of some kind in the mix.

As a general rule, grain free kibbles have more protein and fat than the kibble with grain even though the grain free uses potatoes to stick the kibbles together.
 

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I don't know if any dry food can claim it's grain-free...well, grain-free but not carb-free. Most grain-frees contain potato, sweet potato or tapioca. I'm not sure that potato or tapioca are good or bad for dogs but somehow, the kibble must stay together. Either way, these grain-free foods are not starch free so to those who believe that dogs are strict carnivores and feeding these grain-free kibbles, you are being misled.

I have read that Orijen put tapioca in their food to avoid the diarrhea that many dogs experience with other foods such as EVO. I'm sure our dogs, and humans for that matter, could benefit from less carbs but it just isn't for all dogs.

It's not that you shouldn't feed grain-free to a puppy, it's more the high protein content that cause people to take caution. However, there is debate whether it's the high calcium or the high protein that causes the accelerated growth and thus, the structural problems found in many large breeds. And there are dogs who shouldn't have a high protein food, such as those with kidney problems.

I guess another option would be to feed raw. But some people and some dogs that cannot do it.

So I think you should feed what you think your dog does well on. Or you could end up like me and become neurotic about what food to feed your pets and always think maybe there's something better out there and what if this ingredient is not good for them? etc etc. It's all mind boggling. There are people on this forum who feed Purina and their dogs do well on it so why shouldn't yours do well on Canidae?
 

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I don't know if any dry food can claim it's grain-free...well, grain-free but not carb-free.
That is absolutely true. You cannot make kibble without carbs.

Either way, these grain-free foods are not starch free so to those who believe that dogs are strict carnivores and feeding these grain-free kibbles, you are being misled.
Forcing dogs to eat carbs does not make them omnivores. You can't create an omnivore by feeding vegetable matter to a carnivore. Dogs are definately carnivores. There is no doubt about that.

And there are dogs who shouldn't have a high protein food, such as those with kidney problems.
That old theory has been debunked. The orginal research that "proved" that was done on rats and not dogs. Protein does not cause nor exerbate kidney problems.

There are people on this forum who feed Purina and their dogs do well on it so why shouldn't yours do well on Canidae?
These same people also feed their dogs a lot of supplements.
 

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I don't believe the people on here who feed Purina give a lot of supplements..

Yes there are people who feed their dogs kibbles N bits, Purina, Science Diet, Beneful, etc..and there dogs are fine, but just because they are fine doesn't actually mean they are healthy. Most of those foods are pretty much, well junk. And a lot of times the body doesn't react well to junk, but its internal so we don't see anything going on.

People who want to feed high end, want the best for their dog because it's good food. It's like raising your kid on good fruits and veggies and chicken, not pizza, donuts, and the occasional chicken or hamburger. Yes the kids could probably grow up and live a long life, but it doesn't mean they are 100 percent healthy.
 

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I'm not arguing whether dogs are omnivores or carnivores, just that those who believe they are feeding a grain-free food because they believe the latter, are being misled.

I think Urban Beagles feeds Purina One and shows dogs. And I don't believe she feeds supplements.
(I hope you don't mind Urban, for me mentioning you).

A lot of it comes from genetics.
 

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My Irish Setter breeder feeds Pro Plan performance to her best, currently "useful" dogs, and Pedigree to the older, retired, non showing or hunting dogs. She doesn't supplement.
 

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If you think that you are truly feeding a starch-free diet by feeding these grain-free foods, you are being misled. Many grain-free foods contain potato, potato starch, tapioca, pea fibre etc which help bind the kibble just as grain helps bind the kibble. So your food may be without rice, bran or barley but not without starch. The companies which make these foods are the ones misleading you. I'm not saying their foods are bad; just that they're not starch-free.
 
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