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Hello,

I have a 7 month stray pit that has been with me for the past 4 months... My room mate has been watching dog whisperer and has been trying to get the dog to lay calm next to him. I agree that it is good for the dog to lay down and be submissive, but sometimes he will keep the dog in 1 spot for about 5 hours. The dog never seems to stay still, or stop crying, or shaking. Is this the correct procedure? I run the dog everyday, but sometimes she does not get all of her energy burnt out of her...

Thank you for any advice,
Tommy
 

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I think you answered your own question.... the dog may not be getting burnt out. Surprisingly it takes a lot to burn a dog out. A good 10k run should give you a good start! As for the submissive side hold, that is very hard to accomplish, especially if you've only seen it on TV and have not had it demonstrated in front of you. I would suggest not doing it at all, unless you invite a trainer to show you how and what to wait for. Some dogs take along time to submit, some will also fake it if they n=know how you react to a false sigh....

Burning your dog out mentally and physically daily will be your best bet. If you don't have enough time in the morning to do an extensive run, add a backpack to the dog to give it a job. This will take your half hour walk to a 45min-1hr walk. As for staying still, that comes with training, and stimulation. A bored dog is less likely to respond to commands. Try making your training a little more exciting, then demand a sit, calm. You'd be surprised at the obedience.
 

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Tell your roommate to ignore Ceaser!! Ceaser uses flawed methods of pack leader and alpha roll methods when dogs are not wolves, and even wolves don't forcefully roll each other over!

Your dog does NOT need to be submissive. You need to be your dogs protector and leader, and your dog needs to be able to trust you. Having your dog stay in the same place calmly is not showing them to be calm, its just making them sit in one place for no reason.

If your friend is going to watch a show and take its advice, have them watch Its me or the dog. Thats a fabulous show and the trainer does not believe in the flawed pack method, and shows ways to train and manage your dog efficiently.

Yes exercise is a way to burn out, but if a dog is being forced to stay in the same place for hours that is not nice, and is obviously going to stress the dog out and not teach it anything.
 

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Forcing a dog to sit and stay in one place for 5 hours is an awful idea. Please tell your roommate to some of those hours to take the dog out for a walk and use the rest for obedience training and playtime. Then the dog will be physically and mentally tired and will be calm. Also, tell your roommate that even Cesear says to NEVER use his methods without a professional to help you. Everyday people sitting at home SHOULD NOT attempt any of his methods.
 

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I want to thank everyone for responding to my post. I was very unsure of the approach to take with the dog and the room mate. I am going to begin putting a backback on her and aiming for a longer run...we will see how far I can make it though... Anyway, thank everyone again for your help!

Tommy
 

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Tell your roommate to TRAIN the dog. Cesar's methods are controversial, I think it's safe to say, but those methods are not a replacement for basic training. Or exercise. If one wants a 7 month old pup--especially one from an active breed--to lie still for long periods, one needs to invest serious time in wearing the little guy out.

The analogy that comes to mind is to give an 8 year old child a violin and demand that he "PLAY IT! PLAY IT!". A young child is capable of playing a musical instrument (and sticking with it a couple of hours per day) but he first has to be taught how. And before he is taught to play, he has to have his focus-to-task and self discipline developed. Training a dog is a process; not a series of events. Your roommate needs to be educated before he can teach the pup anything.
 

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Marsh Muppet is completely right. Training a dog isn't the same as forcing a dog to do something. You can physically force a dog to stay in the same spot for 5 hours every day for a year, but she's never going to know the cue "stay" when you want her to stay. Instead, you're likely going to get a very fearful dog.

5 hours is FAR too long to make a dog do ANYTHING... I would consider my dogs good at sit-stays and down-stays, and at the most I will ask them to do half an hour next to me. Spend the time playing outdoors, burning off physical energy, and expending mental energy with training sessions at home. Training a dog isn't as simple as just forcing him to do one thing over and over... it's about learning how to communicate with a dog.
 

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I absolutely agree with burning out the dog's energy. I love to wear Wally out.

Just an example,

Yesterday, I made him chase me around (actually him running around and me just getting in his way sometimes and then running away and getting him to really into whatever you'd call this) then I would stop suddenly, which made him stop suddenly. I throw a cue at him while he's panting and still wound up. This time lie down because of still working on replacing that with the cool way to lie down. If he did it correctly, we keep playing. Otherwise, mini-training until he got it right, then keep playing. Usually takes him just a few tries to do the correct lie down - hold it for a few seconds then back to the game.

Then I'd get him going again (this time with a proper chase game) and repeat that cycle until we're both panting. :D

Oh, but then we have to walk home, so it's a brisk walk home - while again doing some commands and practice with his default behavior and staying in position with me. For this, I'm totally quiet - so it's all on him to figure out what to do and when to do it.

Then when we got back home, it was the rapid-fire training. Got some leftover hamburger out that I was saving for him and trained him with that, going through sit, stay, stand, here (recall), up (standing on hand legs and holding it), and walk (standing on hand legs then taking a few steps to get the food), and few of him figuring out what I want on his own. Threw these at him FAST. It was cue, praise, chomp hamburger, next cue. Then I started putting two or three of them together - all fast. He probably could have killed me when I cued "Up, lie down, up, lie down, up, walk" all for one bit of hamburger :eek: :D

THEN after that, I hit some fish sticks and french fries under his bed covers, so he had to sniff them out to get them. He got five of them (hid six), he couldn't even muster up a sniff to find the sixth one. He just laid down, sighed, and had to rest. Soon after, he drifted off to sleep and I could hear him sleep-barking about 10 minutes later.

I usually do this at least twice a day with some burst physical activity then heavy mental activity, or a long brisk walk (good for us both) and then training/mental games once back inside. The high-paced running type activities have training components in them as well.

I have no problem keeping Wally calm during the down time - don't even need a cue him to do anything (though I usually tell him "on your spot" so he can rest on his comfortable bed). Sometimes, though, he'll want to curl up the floor next to me after lying on his bed a little while. I don't mind, of course, just wonder why he'd give up his nice bed to lie on the floor :)



As far as the shaking and crying, DON'T be harsh with him. That's just going to either make it worse or suppress him and I don't believe in that. He's trying to communicate something to you. He could be bored but not knowing what to do. I don't have a problem with training him in that state. If he'll listen and follow cues, then at least his head is clear enough to still be connected to you. You can work with that, but you do have to train him, and, I would train some movement cues like practicing recall or just playing a game of hide-n-seek. Movement and mental challenge all in one.
 

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Your room mate is ignoring some of Cesar's methods. Cesar teaches Exercise, Discipline and Affection in that order. If you start with a restless dog with a ton of energy and go straight to Discipline you're not going to get anywhere at all. Walk the dog for 4-5 miles with a pack. When the dog is worn out, then go into the Discipline part and you'll have a whole more success.
 

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I don't even understand what the purpose of asking a dog to sit by one's side for five hours straight is. Has your roommate explained why he wants the dog to do this? Maybe there's some problem between the two of them that could be solved some other way.
 

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Forcing a dog to sit and stay in one place for 5 hours is an awful idea. Please tell your roommate to some of those hours to take the dog out for a walk and use the rest for obedience training and playtime. Then the dog will be physically and mentally tired and will be calm. Also, tell your roommate that even Cesear says to NEVER use his methods without a professional to help you. Everyday people sitting at home SHOULD NOT attempt any of his methods.
Short, sweet, and to the point. :) Not to mention Cesear is dealing with aggressive dogs or dogs with serious behavioral problems and it doesn't sounds like your dog fits this description. Cesear is definately controversial so I like to stick with what I know works. If I am not sure about a method and my dog is whining and shaking and seems that distressed about it, I would definately not do it.
 
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