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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited by Moderator)
Ok my female is dog aggressive, she can however take walks with other dogs and not run after dogs she sees and attack them, however when we are out and a dog may walk too close she will growl in a mean way she used to lunge when I had her in class, she no longer does that, I watch Ceaser all the time and Im wondering if I can have her be a dog that gets along with other dogs and play and have a jolly time.. I was advised to walk her in a dog park, but I dont think that would be a good idea since so many people dont care what their dogs are doing, so what I was thinking was walking her with a few dogs she knows (muzzled) maybe following them get a quick sniff and vice versa, but only for a second.. today at the pet store she sat in line with a lab in front of us looking at her and she just layed down and looked the other way (GREAT SIGN) So any help please would help.. Oh and the cat bites I have to keep him locked up for 10 days hospital was supposed to report tge bite by law but didnt, I noticecd the cat was vomiting water today, the vet said just wait until the 10th have him checked if all is good no worry if he gets worse then the outcome is poor :( trap is set wish me luck catching the stray im using sardines :)
 

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Re: Desenstizing a dig aggressive dog

CGC's and dog aggression are on opposite ends of the spectrum.

I suspect something else is going on. One of the biggest underlying causes of 'aggression' (besides health issues) is stress. Stress of out on a walk...the world coming at the dog fast and furious and not sure how to handle it. Or, resource guarding (of owner)...incorrectly labeled aggression. Or, incomplete socialization as a puppy. Or, owner training errors, ie; lots of leash pops/lots of tension whenever another dog showed up.

You'll need some expert eyes to see what's going on. Perhaps your instructor can make a recommendation.
 

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Your best bet is to get a professional on board to evaluate the situation and help you re mediate the problem. Dog aggression can have many causes and triggers, anything from lack of communication skills, to fear to resource guarding. I can give you some suggestions for management of the situation such as knowing your dogs body language and making sure you keep him focused on YOU when other dogs get too close to better help you to keep him under control. As far as introducing him to other dogs, even witha muzzle I'd ONLY do so under professional guidance and I'd use this technique Meet Me in the Middle – The Best Way To Introduce Dogs
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
My female has been in training since she was 5 months old (obedience) then puppy class before that, one thing however is when she was between 8-12 weeks old she was "almost" attacked by the neighbors golden, at the time my American Bulldog jumped in front of her and took the beating, now that wasnt the only time, a few other times I was in my yard walking the dogs to potty and again the dog attacked, he went right for my male that time and I put my female inside. I dont snap her leash unless needed as far as correction but she doesnt usually even require that when we are out walking.. But NO WAY would I take her to a dog park that is just stupid, she used to play with my inlaws labs all the time, the last time I was there I admit I was nervous so my mother in law took her out of the car and she played just fine... when she got her cgc the evaluater put head collars on her dog and Gypsy and walked them, and then walked them in the same hand next to each other around the parking lot, it was like the other dog wasnt even there.


Oh Carla. I do know how to get her focus on me, she knows the "watch" command I don't use the word NO I say AHAAA I always thought she was people aggressive but I was wrong on that, she loves attention, but she isnt so fond of strange men approaching me, she had some issues with a few conractors here a few years ago, but those were the only people in 2 yrs.
 

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There are signs that your dog is going to growl or snap at another dog or person... Learn the signs and correct your dog before It escalates.
 

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NEVER EVER CORRECT A GROWL! Growls are a warning, learn your dogs stress signs and get the OUT of the situation BEFORE a warning is needed.
 

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No more Ceasar Millan. Issuing collar corrections on a dog who is aggressive WILL heighten the aggressive response.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
My trainer always gives collar corrections and for Gypsy it worked, she is a well knowed trainer and trains police/narcotics and arson dogs here in Michigan and Tennesee and I trust her, she loves people (besides the 2 guys) who knows maybe she knew more then I when they were here. people come over its instant hugs and belly rubs...

I know some dogs can never be turned around from being dog aggressive, but I sure hope i can, at least to a certain degree, I waited 3 months before i allowed her and my other rott to be together to play, which my trainer stated was too long even though they are best buds now, since I will be getting a third in a month all her training is back in place, but I never EVER allow my dogs/animals to be in harms way...


Speaking of DOg parks what is everyones input on them? there is on near me 700 acres trails and a pond, I thought about taking Cash since he loves other dogs, but again some people take aggressive dogs there and there is no law against it.. only dogs in heat cannot attend.
 

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No more Ceasar Millan. Issuing collar corrections on a dog who is aggressive WILL heighten the aggressive response.
Interesting as that has not been the case for my dogs. A collar correction associated with a verbal warning (leave it) was all that was needed and my dogs know not to go there. Maybe what you are saying is true for some dogs but not all.
 

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In your case that sounds like you corrected before the aggression really started, hence a leave it command working appreciably. I don't agree with it because there's nothing stopping your dog from associating the jerk on his neck with the other dog, making him more fearful and/or aggressive next time around, in anticipation of the discomfort. That's just my opinion though.
 

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I have to repeat again...you need proper assessment for your dog aggression problem. It only happens in close quarters? Only on leash? She had some scary issues when she was young and she wasn't socialized as a pup? (this is what I'm taking from your posts, so please correct me if I'm misinterpreting your words).
Dog aggression and fear aggression and misunderstanding/not having good dog social skills are ALL different things. A truly dog aggressive dog is ALWAYS dog aggressive in all situations. Fear aggression is the most common cause of aggression between dogs. If it IS fear based, corrections are only going to escalate the behaviour or cause her to shut down (which can mean nasty surprises months or years later). Rotties are sometimes hard to read by other dogs (and by people) due to the colouration and build (including the docked tail) and their general stockiness. Lots of miscommunications can happen.

I would recommend a couple of books:
"Fiesty Fido" and "The Cautious Canine" by Patricia McConnell and Karen London.
"Click to Calm" by Emma Parsons
"On Talking Terms with Dogs: Calming Signals" by Turid Rugaas.

As for the cat bites, I'm glad you are healing. I always wondered about the ten day quarantine thing...if it's a Rabies concern ten days isn't going to show signs of rabies, it can stay dormant for more than six months and if your cat is vaccinated the chances are practically non existent.
Good luck trapping the stray.
 

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I always wondered about the ten day quarantine thing...if it's a Rabies concern ten days isn't going to show signs of rabies, it can stay dormant for more than six months and if your cat is vaccinated the chances are practically non existent.
But they only shed it for 10 days prior to death. So if an animal (well, cats, dogs, and ferrets are the only animals that have been studied on this) is still alive 10 days after a bite, it was not shedding rabies when it bit you.
 

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Thanks for clarifying that...it's the first good answer for that question I've come across. Makes sense to me.
 

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I don't agree with it because there's nothing stopping your dog from associating the jerk on his neck with the other dog, making him more fearful and/or aggressive next time around, in anticipation of the discomfort. That's just my opinion though.
My understanding in reading the dogs current behavior is that the dog ( I hope) associates the correction with me and my displeasure and desire not to have such behavior present again . This is why for example I do not prefer to use a remote collar for corrections as I want the dog to know from who and where the correction is coming from. My dogs now just refrain from displaying aggression for the most part and have learned to take pressure off and allow me to access any threats. Off course everyone has a different opinion and experiences as not all dogs respond equally to any given approach and this is just mine.
If my dog were actually engaged in a fight and making contact I would probably be more focused on the process of breaking up the fight. Of course the correction could immediately follow. A true correction I believe in most cases should effectively reduce such displays of aggressive behavior, and if not then no correction occured but only a failed attempt at delivering one. In my opinion the reason why I can shut down any aggression in my dogs quite easily should thier be any signs is because they have found that the consequence and stress on our relationship to do so is not worth it for the most part.

There may be other ways but this works perfect for me and I cannot say that my dogs aggression has been heightened or resulted in backlash behaviors later on (maybe I just got lucky?) as they now seem to get along now with even the unruley dogs that they come into contact with without being so....aggressive. It is like they seem to know that they do not need to go after the other dog and they choose for the most part to stay calm.
:)
 

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Like I said, diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks. I prefer the use of treat and praise rewards without a correction as a precursor. I also feel that by proofing the commands in increasingly more-difficult situations, the need for the correction at all is eliminated.
 

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Please don't get me wrong as I agree with the fact that different things can work and that there are many approaches. I was just commenting on the assertion that if one uses a correction xy&z will always happen to which I have not found to be the case.

I hope the OP finds a solution that best fits.
 

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There may be other ways but this works perfect for me and I cannot say that my dogs aggression has been heightened or resulted in backlash behaviors later on (maybe I just got lucky?) as they now seem to get along now with even the unruley dogs that they come into contact with without being so....aggressive. It is like they seem to know that they do not need to go after the other dog and they choose for the most part to stay calm.
:)
Not lucky...good handling. The major difference here (which you practice) is actually taking charge....showing your dogs that you will handle the situation....they can relax....you've got it covered.

But, the way most people handle the problem is by repeatedly jerking the leash...the dog is still out front lunging madly and barking so, they jerk even harder, more frequently and often yell at the dog while doing that.

This is the equivilant of baiting the dog....provoking even greater 'aggression'/response in future encounters....exactly how dog fighters train their dogs. So, it's much more than just randomly popping the leash and getting results.
 

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Agreed. In order for a correction to be effective it must be perfectly timed AND strong enough that it is effective within one to three occurrences. Repeated leash pops are simply nagging the dog, and can simply amp the dog up more.

I am a positive trainer so I do not use P+ (corrections) in my training and much PREFER Miss Mutt's form of dealing with the issue presented by the OP. Not only because I believe in teaching the dog what I want him to do, not what I don't want him to do but also because FEW average dog owners have the skill and timing needed to provide a properly executed correction and that the chances of fallout caused by punishment (including shutdown in a sensitive dog, subversion of the behaviour and association of a punisher with something OTHER than the handler) are high.
 

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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
GREAT NEWS I went to my FILs today to help them with their lab, he likes to run to the road and they live on a busy street, I am a firm believer in an e-collar if used coorectly, even if its just the pager button used, so I help with some training and in a matter of 10 minutes he stayed away from the road, I guess for the whole day, but I will continue to help them out... Anyhow I intruduced Gypsy and him and he is a dominant intact male 1yr old both were muzzles for precauctions, no tense leashes body landuages watched, soon muzzles were off and Gypsy now has a new friend OMG I was soooo happy... that has been the fist time since we were in class that she was that close to a dog beside her cgc, Im so proud...

Sorry one more thing Gypsy was socialized from day 1 as a pup. puppy classes, stores, parks, schools you name it.. But she did have some negitive experience when she was almost attacked at a young age. And also I believe Gentics play a part I was unaware when I bought her about Rottweiler gentics with parents and all, heck all dogs that is, well her mom was like her, kinda skittish at times and dog aggressive... but I am determined to make her better :) its my responsiblity and I am getting another pup at the end of the month and I think 100% she will be great like she was with Cash.
 
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