[Blap]

Hello, first of all, I must excuse for my English, as I'm not a native speaker.

Here we go.
I usually feed my one year and a half aged English cocker chichen skeletons or necks, in a raw way, as I was highly recomended to do so for complementing his dried fodder.

Question 1: am I doing right?

What makes me doubt is that when he poohs the matter is compact and my dog appears not to be very comfortable pushing it out. Today, what has made me write here, it seemed to have caused a little pain when he dirtied the grass.

Question 2: Can this sort of raw food (raw chicken skeletons) harm my dog?

I'm not sure whether my message is being come across. I hope it is fully understandable. If not, please, let me know and I'll be more concise.

Many thanks in advance for your time.

 

[jesirose]

It sounds like he is getting too much bone, and is constipated. Try more meat on the bones. Instead of necks, offer legs and breasts with some bone.

 

[Blap]

Well, in fact it is rather with chicken skeleton than with necks that I note him more difficulties when dropping his poohs. Note that necks are said to be rich in cartilage rather than in bones.

So, not advisable to feed raw skeletons, though they are meaty indeed.

Do raw feeders give chicken skeletons to dogs?

Shouldn't I be so worried?

Thanks.

 

[phoebespeople]

Your English is just fine.
Chicken backs and necks, or skeletons as you say, are great for your dog, but they have too much bone and not enough meat. You have to give your dog some muscle meat with them, or altenate meals of skeletons and muscle meat. Ideally, you want 70-80% meat, 10-15% bone, and 10-15% organs like liver and kidneys.
If you buy whole chickens and cut them into meal sized chunks then you have the perfect ratio of meat to bone, just add a few chicken livers and it's balanced.

 

[jesirose]

Sorry, I don't quite understand your reply.

Which part of the skeleton are you giving him? If you just gave him the WHOLE chicken with meat too, he'd be okay. If you're giving just backs, it's too much bone. Add meat. He may be a dog that needs more meat than some.

I give my dog all parts of the chicken.

If he is straining and hurting you should be concerned, and give less bone and more meat. Otherwise, it's fine.

 

[Blap]

Well, I meant the backs.
I suppose I should give more meat with the backs.
Chicken backs and necks are sold here in Spain in plasticized trays at a quite cheap price, for human consumption for making stock. I thought it could be a good way of improving the quatity of my dog's feed.

Thank you for your compliment, phoebespeople.

Thank you all.

 

[Kathyy]

I briefly thought the same last year. Some people that feed BARF use a lot of chicken bone with vegetables, ground meat and organ as a diet. I learned that meat is more important than bone so now I use that chicken skeleton and add lots of boneless meat plus a small amount of liver and kidney. Just adding the skeleton is not a good idea as you have found out! Any cheap meat will do. Around here pork is usually the cheapest after chicken.

 

[Blap]

I have heard of a certain reluctance to feeding pork, don't ask me why. I suppose it's for the parasites.

Anyway, I'll follow your recommendations, adding boneless meat to the cheap skeletons. I feel like getting more and more into raw feeding.

I think it's about having them (dogs) eat something else than bones, either meat or vegetables, so that the poops will be somehow middle hard middle soft. Well, it might be a hypothesis to be proven.

Today afternoon (remember, I'm Spanish) I gave about eight chicken necks (well, the last time I gave the same amount of chicken necks as today I did, it didn't cause any problems to my dog), but this time I added one and a half boiled egg, that way there will be more matter to digest.

I supposed that meaty bones was the correct diet, avoiding the intake of too much protein substance. But now, you say there have to feed just meat because meaty bones is not just good. What a mess!!

By the way, should I be concerned about feeding raw pork meat? Wouldn't it better to freeze that raw meat before?

Thank you again, I am learning a lot with your feedback.

 

[jesirose]

If you want to use pork, freeze it for 4 weeks first.

 

[MaddieTheDog]

I thought dogs were never supposed to eat bones because they can choke or cut them?

 

[DobManiac]

If you want to use pork, freeze it for 4 weeks first.

Is that true?

I've never done that with my dogs. What are you trying to avoid by freezing the pork for 4 weeks? I have heard that is necessary for wild game, but I thought everything farm raised or bought from stores was safe.

 

[Willowy]

I thought dogs were never supposed to eat bones because they can choke or cut them?

Cooked bones will splinter and are dangerous. Raws bones are safer.

Is that true?

I've never done that with my dogs. What are you trying to avoid by freezing the pork for 4 weeks? I have heard that is necessary for wild game, but I thought everything farm raised or bought from stores was safe.

In the U.S., pork is reasonably safe.....I don't know about in Spain, though.

 

[jesirose]

I freeze a lot of stuff anyway because I have a freezer and buy in bulk.

"Trichinellosis is a parasitic disease caused by a roundworm of the Trichinella genus that infects carnivorous and omnivorous animals, including domestic swine and wild game (e.g., bears, cougars, and wild boars) (1)" - http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5206a1.htm

It is mostly eradicated in the US, but the OP is in Spain. Furthermore, it can't HURT to freeze it to be safe.

 

[DobManiac]

I freeze a lot of stuff anyway because I have a freezer and buy in bulk.

"Trichinellosis is a parasitic disease caused by a roundworm of the Trichinella genus that infects carnivorous and omnivorous animals, including domestic swine and wild game (e.g., bears, cougars, and wild boars) (1)" - http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5206a1.htm

It is mostly eradicated in the US, but the OP is in Spain. Furthermore, it can't HURT to freeze it to be safe.

Thanks for the link. I also buy in bulk, so meat tend to be in the freezer for two or three weeks before I get around to it. But all I tend to pay attention to is feeding older meat first, not to a minimum amount of frozen time.

Isn't most meat we buy in the grocery store frozen for 3 to 4 months before it gets to us anyway?

 

[Blap]

I cannot indicate any comparison, but I suppose here in Spain, and I would say in the whole European Union, we have the compulsory safety controls that guarantee a healthy living. Actually, no problems of this kind arise.

But I wonder, how that you don't see pork meat in any dried or even canned food for dogs? You just can see duck, chicken, lamb, fish, but not pork, even though it is a considerable source of byproducts and such.

And what about fish, can I mix meat (chicken skeletons or necks) with fish in a meal, I mean raw? And If I can. Is it necessary to freeze that fish?

Thank you all for your feedback. My doggy and I are really grateful.

 

[phoebespeople]

If you can find fresh or frozen whole mackerel or sardines, or a similar fish, or canned sardines in water with as little salt as possible, you can give a few with any meal, or a bunch for a whole meal once in a while.
Fresh raw salmon is one fish that people say has a problem with a particular parasite, but freezing it for some time will appearently kill that parasite.

 

[Kathyy]

There are some pork premium kibbles but not many. I know beef is avoided as it gets labeled as something dogs are allergic to.

Mix up proteins if you like. I do. Max gets a bit of bony chicken, some boneless pork or beef and a bit of organ daily. I also put in a piece of raw mackerel or sardine in most meals. It is a good idea to freeze fish as well. There are worms that can be transmitted in them same as pork. Seems it would be more likely as the sardines and mackerel are wild caught fish!

 

[Blap]

You can't imagine how tedious I can be. lol

In case I decide on the fish, for how long are they to be frozen?

And what about (this is getting too familiar in this thread, please sorry)... and what about legumes like peas, beans or chickpeas, boiled with some chicken meat to make it palatable, and added to the raw skeletons or necks to make te bones less bony.

Many thanks.