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I'll bite. I'm guessing that the middle link is to the responsible Border Collie breeder.
 

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See, and I'd say Janice De Mello is absolutely responsible. Hob Nob is super-well known, too.

I think the bigger thing with these three is they look like VERY different types of dog.
 

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First and third. Didn't even have to read anything. The layout of the website and the fact that the 2nd has pictures of dogs working on the front page tells all.

I'm going to feel really sheepish if I'm wrong....
 

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I only looked at the first link and the biggest thing I noticed was the planned litters. 3 litters are planned for February. That seems like a bit much...
 

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From a bc boards point of view, the responsible one is the middle.
 

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First and third. Didn't even have to read anything. The layout of the website and the fact that the 2nd has pictures of dogs working on the front page tells all.
Based on my interaction with BC fanciers, that was my reasoning, too. :) I know that variability in type isn't an issue. Also, isn't the ee red collie also known as the "Australian red?" I seem to remember from somewhere that that color is tentatively linked to some genetic issues in BCs, including (maybe) PRA?
 

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Perhaps I missed it, but I didn't see anything about genetic testing on the websites for the first two breeders.

Ah, now I see where it says the first breeder tests...

...even so, I'll bet the first and last breeders listed are the ones considered irresponsible by traditional working BC fanciers, but I would certainly look to Jan Demello for a sport dog.
 

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Here's the thing though- Janice DeMello co-owns a LOT of dogs, and I know for a fact how carefully screened the owners are. (She's also been trialling dogs in obedience for 20+ years, so frankly? She's got the demand. Let her meet it.)

This is just three different facets of the BC world. I'd say they ARE all responsible. Whether you think they're reputable is going to depend on what you think 'bettering the breed' is defined as.
 

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That was carefully worded, lol.
Hehe, it's politics and a breed I'm interested in owning. I don't want to offend anyone. ;)

Dogstar is right in that there are three facets of the bc world with very differing viewpoints. They don't really see eye to eye on what 'bettering the breed' means in the border collie. I know what I think and the style of dogs I like.
 

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Hehe, it's politics and a breed I'm interested in owning. I don't want to offend anyone. ;)

Dogstar is right in that there are three facets of the bc world with very differing viewpoints. They don't really see eye to eye on what 'bettering the breed' means in the border collie. I know what I think and the style of dogs I like.
There is a BIG difference in the looks of the working bc vs. the conformation shown bc - why can't they meet in the middle?
 

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There is a BIG difference in the looks of the working bc vs. the conformation shown bc - why can't they meet in the middle?
The argument is this: (I'm trying to leave personal opinions on the matters out but it's hard)

If you breed for conformation, then you must sacrifice to some extent on working ability, especially in this breed. Then you're lowering the standard for working dogs for the sake of looks, which don't matter to a farmer or rancher. Remember, soundness is different many times than conformation even though conf is supposed to test the usefullness of a dog. The conf dogs often have too much coat than is practical, there is a lot of standardization in markings. Working dogs can look a million different ways (and they do). they vary over what they were bred to work, the terrain of the area, etc. The type of dog bred for conf is just so different than the type bred for working- their origins are different. Conf dogs are bred from imports from Australia, often heavier coated, heavier bones...

Think about it in another breed. You see people usually breeding one type of shepherd or another. Why would someone really into police work go to an American Showline GSD?? You're much more liable to get what you need from proven working lines.
 

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I ask the same thing about GSD people Box :p
 

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Discussion Starter #19
There is a BIG difference in the looks of the working bc vs. the conformation shown bc - why can't they meet in the middle?
I guess they kind of have... with people who work (herd) their dogs calling conformation BCs Barbie Collies... and agility bred dogs sport collies... lol


The responsible breeder was Red Top Kennels, the one in the middle. I guess that you could argue that they are all responsible... for most breeds of dogs they would be... but I guess I should have said Working (Herding) Border Collies

For any of you who have questions, you can go to this link http://bordercollie.org/core.html
 
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