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Discussion Starter #1
I've done this before on here but there are new members since last time so more opinions for me. I'm not looking at getting a dog right now. I'm a senior in college and will be graduating in the spring so I'm wanting to wait until I know where I will be after I graduate before adding another dog. Right now I'm indecisive about what I'm wanting for my next dog. I currently have an 8 year old australian shepherd and I want to add another dog before he gets too much older because I don't want to make him deal with a puppy in his senior years.

So what I am looking for:
  • Size: very un decided on what I'm wanting size wise. My ideal dog would be about 30-45 lbs. However, I am considering anything from toy sized to 50 lbs.
  • Coat: I prefer feathered medium-long coats. I don't like really thick long coats (like rough collie). I don't like curly coats either (like poodles). Short coats are ok but not preferred. I also would be fine with a wire coat that just needs to be stripped. I don't want anything that has to be professionally groomed. I don't mind brushing but I spend a lot of time out in the woods so I want a dog that is going to just need a quick brushing to clean off.
  • Appearance: I like thin, athletic built dogs. I don't like stocky dogs or brachy breeds. I like needle nose breeds like sight hounds and collies so I'm fine with that. No drooly dogs either.
  • Energy: High energy! I'm very outdoorsy and want a dog that will enjoy all my activities. I like a dog that can come on long (all day) trail rides and be able to keep up with a horse. I like a dog that will enjoy swimming in the lake, dock diving, and going out on the boat with me. I like hiking and camping with my dogs. I want a dog that will play fetch like its their job. I will be competing in agility with this dog as well as any other sports I can find in my area (flyball, frisbee, herding, obedience.. whatever I find).
  • Drive: I like a lot of drive! This is pretty important to me, I really like a high drive dog.
  • Must be able to be trusted off leash (with training of course).
  • Tainability: I like highly biddable breeds that want to learn. I also like dogs that are problem solvers and quick thinking.
  • I like velcro dogs.
  • I don't want a happy go lucky, loves everyone they meet dog. I like my dogs to be aloof with strangers. I also like a dog that will alert me when someone is on the property.
  • Needs to be able to get along with others dogs at least ones it lives with. I don't want any breeds that are likely to be DA, but I can deal with a little DR.
  • I have cats so it needs to be able to be trusted with them.
  • I dont want a really goofy breed, I like a dog that has goofy moments but not constantly silly dogs.
  • I love herding breeds and they are what I know but I'm interested in dogs from other groups too. I'm not as familiar with the other groups but if you think of a breed that would meet my requirements I'm interested in learning.
Other things to consider:

I'm more interested in finding a dog that my current dog will be fine with. He isn't aggressive with other dogs but he doesn't like them. He really just ignores other dogs. He doesn't want to play with them and he won't like a dog that is constantly trying to get him to play. He has been raised with other dogs and he is great with them but he also grew up living with them. He hates going to my moms house now because of her puppy. He loved the puppy when she was really young but now that she's older and tries to get him to play constantly he is very uncomfortable. I'm hoping that it would be different with him living with the new dog as opposed to this dog that he only sees every couple weeks. He did great with her when I kept her for a couple weeks when she was young.

Its also possible that I will be living in an apartment for awhile. I hope to get a place out of town as soon as I can but its very likely I will be in an apartment or townhouse for the next couple years. The dog would still be spending a large amount of time out at the barn with me where I keep my horse and will be getting adequate exercise so I don't think the apartment will be a problem as far as having a high energy breed. But it will affect what breeds I can have since a lot of them have restrictions.

I have a lot of breeds in mind but I want to hear what you all recommend.
 

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Not sure where in KY you're located, but a friend of mine (Australian Shepherd and Cattle Dog Rescue) is currently fostering this 2 year old male ACD on the east coast of Georgia/Southeast SC area. He is a ranch dog - his owners bought him for herding their livestock and left him behind when they moved. Extremely sweet and obedient (no fencing), but it's unlikely he was an active and loving part of their family. 096.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I do like ACDs and that dog sounds awsome but I'm not looking at getting a dog right now. It will most likely be at least a year before I add another dog. I'm not sure ACD is what I'm wanting for my next dog. I really like the breed and I have a lot of friends with great ACDS but I'm not quite sold on them. There are a lot of things I like about them (their drive, intelligence, aloof with strangers, high energy, the fact that they are one person dogs..) and they are a possibility for a future dog for me but I'm just not crazy about them (not very biddable, don't really like the stocky build).

I honestly know very little about Canaan dogs. They might be a breed to look into.

As far as spaniels go, most don't seem to be very aloof with strangers. I do like Brittanys though.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Can anyone think of a smaller breed that would have the stamina to keep up with a horse on long trail rides and be trusted off leash? My current dog seems to like small dogs best, he was raised with a little dog so I think that has something to do with it. But I just cant think of any small breeds that could handle the horse rides and meet my other requirements. I know small dogs are riskier to have around horses but I make sure any dog I have around horses learns certain commands to keep them safe (like back and out to keep them away from the horse)
 

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Most terriers would have plenty of stamina but obviously the off leash thing would be iffy since a lot of terriers aren't known to be trusted off leash. Though I know a lot of terriers who are fine off leash... a Border Terrier may be a better option for that kind of stuff. Ummm.... Corgi? Don't know about their "off leash reliability" but corgis and horses/farms/etc often go hand in hand from what I've seen. They are like a big dog though on short legs, lol. I mean, a lot of little dogs could definitely keep up. Most little ones I know have a ton of energy, it's just a matter of finding the right dog, I suppose. What about a Poodle? They are known to be highly trainable, friendly, most seem to be fine off leash, have a lot of energy?
 

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you sound like me lol, and my perfect dog is working Border Collies. a BC fits every single one of your requirments :)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I have thought about parson russell terrier or border terriers. I love the look of border terriers but everything I've heard about them says they can not be trusted off a leash at all. And I have very little experience with terriers other than I watched a Lakeland terrier for a month one time and after that I said I'd never get a terrier. Corgis I'm afraid couldn't keep up with the horses. We go at a pretty fast speed sometimes especially when I'm riding a walking horse.

I love working BCs! They are on my short list for sure! I've just lately been leaning toward getting a smaller dog really just because I think my current dog would be happier with a little dog. He has lived with another large dog and did fine with that dog too so I'm not dead set on a little dog, its just something I've been thinking about lately.

I guess I'll list my (really long) short list of breeds I'm considering and can't make up my mind about. I'm a really indecisive person. These are in no particular order.

Australian Shepherd
Border Collie
Sheltie (not crazy about the coat)
Papillion (obviously too small for the horse riding)
Pyrenean Shepherd (smooth face not the rough)

And the breeds I'm kind of interested in but know very little about

Schipperke
Border terrier
Parson russell terrier
Mudi
 

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I do like ACDs and that dog sounds awsome but I'm not looking at getting a dog right now. It will most likely be at least a year before I add another dog. I'm not sure ACD is what I'm wanting for my next dog. I really like the breed and I have a lot of friends with great ACDS but I'm not quite sold on them. There are a lot of things I like about them (their drive, intelligence, aloof with strangers, high energy, the fact that they are one person dogs..) and they are a possibility for a future dog for me but I'm just not crazy about them (not very biddable, don't really like the stocky build).

I honestly know very little about Canaan dogs. They might be a breed to look into.

As far as spaniels go, most don't seem to be very aloof with strangers. I do like Brittanys though.

Not all ACDs are not biddable. In fact once the dog becomes yours biddability increases. You have to earn it.
ACD's should not be stocky persay.... Alot of them out there are too stocky. A lot are fat. My dog Merlin is a BIG ACD as far as frames go. Right at the top of the standard. But he weighs 51-52 pounds. Most dogs similar in frame size to him will go on the other side of 60. Some say things like Merlin is too skinny, lacks bone, etc. Would he look better with a tad more bone. Maybe. Would he perform better? I doubt it. In fact at a sprint he will run away from those heavier built dogs. He is in the top three fastest ACD's I know.
 

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Pyrsheps are crazy, I serious reccomend being VERY carful if you keep that on your list, nearly every Pyrshep in NA is closly related, and while some are great, most are really freaky in the head, they tend to exell at the tasks you give them, but are very difficult to live with. to give you an idea of numbers, I used to own a Pyrshep, I knew his breeder well, every puppy she bred(she only had 3 litters) went to super expirienced owners/trainers, most of the pups were very successful dogs....exept at being a companian, because not a single one of those puppies is still in its orignial home, even the breeder didnt keep her's. we rehomed ours to a top agility trainer...even she couldnt handle him and she rehomed him after only a few days. I really really really reccomend you be wary of them!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I'm starting to lean toward shelties. I've found a breeder in Indiana that has working shelties that I'm really interested in right now. My only concern with them is their coat though. My aussie's coat is so easy to deal with. When he gets muddy out at the barn I just have to wait a couple hours and he's as clean as if he's had a bath. This past weekend the burs were really bad out where we were riding and his coat was full of burs but it just took a quick brushing to get them out. Of course he doesn't have much coat to deal with compared to a lot of aussies. How difficult is a sheltie coat to keep clean? I'm fine with a quick brushing every day but I don't want to deal with having to give baths or spending long amounts of time grooming every time I take the dog out riding with me.

Also, this may be an odd question, but do shelties enjoy swimming generally? I know some breeds just tend to not enjoy water as much as others and I'm hoping for another dog that will enjoy the lake.

I am interested in miniature american shepherds too, in particular Wigglebutt.

That is good to know about the pyr sheps. I definitely will want to go out and meet as many dogs as I can of whatever breed I decide on. Especially if I were to go with a breed like the pyr shep that is more rare.
 

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Laurelin owned shelties. She says that dirt just schluffed off the course coat and my roommate agrees with this(she grew up with a sheltie). Rumor has it that the poorly bred shelties have a finer coat that is harder to maintain.

I'm still interested in pyr sheps as a maybe someday breed for me but I've yet to meet any.

But if you're super happy with Boomer and you just want a smaller version of him, I'd contact the Wigglebutt breeder. Get a feel for what those dogs are like and try to meet them. I've met a lot of poorly bred "mini aussies" so I am wary but wigglebutt has health testing out the wazoo and proven dogs(titles in many different venues).
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I think I've only been around poorly bred shelties, I know I've never been around any shelties from working lines for sure. I think thats why I've never really considered them. Laurelin recommended them to me last time I started one of these threads so I started looking into them a little and I think the right sheltie might be what I'm looking for. The ones we got into work (groomer) were always really matted and dirty but of course these were poorly bred and with owners that didn't brush them at all. I've also noticed a lot of the ones I've seen have very little drive and are absolutely terrified of everything around them. I know they are like most herders and have their strange quirks and thats something I like about them but I don't want a dog that is scared of everything in life. I think a lot of that is the poor breeding. Most shelties in my area come from one breeder that I would almost consider a puppy mill so I don't think these shelties are a fair example of the breed.

I really do like the Wigglebutt dogs and I am going to keep them on my list for sure. I think I do need to get out there and meet some dogs from different breeders and see what will fit me best. I keep going back and forth on whether I want another aussie as my next dog. I love the breed, I know the breed, and I know that they are perfect for me. But I kind of want to try another breed for my next dog. There are so many breeds out there that I think I would like and I'm a little afraid I'd just be comparing another aussie to Boomer constantly. I will always have an aussie around but sometimes I think I just want to wait until after Boomer to get a second one. He's just extra special and I think he's the only aussie I need for now if that makes any sense at all.

I still do want to meet some pyr sheps. Some things about them sound great and then there are some things that sound not so great for me but I'd like to get to know some dogs and see for myself.
 

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You should maybe consider a mix breed of some kind? The collies, Australian sheppards, blue heeler (cattle dog) , australian Kelpie (sheep dog) are all great suggestions based on your "requirements". A mini australian sheppard/collie mix perhaps would be great.

I have a Kelpie/Border Collie mix (also some aussie shepp in him as well) his coat is extremely low maintenance, he's a medium sized dog (should not exceed 45lbs/20") extremely high energy, very loyal and obedient (my pup is almost 5 months and his offleash/recall is %100) I take him for all day long hikes and he just loves being outdoors, and is a top notch agility prospect too (currently in agility training). Oh and the little bugger likes to fetch sticks out of the river too!

Anyways, just my two cents. Good luck finding a puppy!
 

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for the Pyrsehps I would avoid anything going back to Harley(Weskeys La Brise Bluboy Rshvn)which may be hard, he sired a LOT of litters, however my experience in the breed is almost entirly his immediete family(full siblings, parents and grandparents) I dont know how he is, I havent seen him since he was a little puppy, but when that much of his family is wacky in the head, I would be wary of his offspring lol

OTH if you could find anything related to Tison(Taliesin Timbalier de La Brise
) without a close connection to Harley, THAT would be a good choice,I know Ticon as well, and he is awsome and rock solid.
 

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Pyrsheps are crazy, I serious reccomend being VERY carful if you keep that on your list, nearly every Pyrshep in NA is closly related, and while some are great, most are really freaky in the head, they tend to exell at the tasks you give them, but are very difficult to live with. to give you an idea of numbers, I used to own a Pyrshep, I knew his breeder well, every puppy she bred(she only had 3 litters) went to super expirienced owners/trainers, most of the pups were very successful dogs....exept at being a companian, because not a single one of those puppies is still in its orignial home, even the breeder didnt keep her's. we rehomed ours to a top agility trainer...even she couldnt handle him and she rehomed him after only a few days. I really really really reccomend you be wary of them!
I haven't met any but from what I hear from the working BC people, a few said they wouldn't want to own one because they're hyperactive. I think it's because all the ones we have here are sport bred and they've been bred to be more hyper than the actual working animals.

Also Lauren17, your list just screams BC to me! I guess most of the herders would be fine for you too...
 
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