Feeding Raw - Where to Start?
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Thread: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

  1. #241
    Senior Member Sibe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by mzink View Post
    Hello I have a question. Over the past two weeks I have been using the raw diet threads on this forum as well as other websites as a guide for switching my dog to raw. So far so good, no stomach issues or problems adjusting. The reason I decided to try is because my dog has always had chronic skin issues. He gets rashes, welts, looses large patches of fur, gets lots of dandruff etc. I've tried tried special foods, special shampoos, sprays, products from his vet, all these things have helped with managing it but it does not get rid of it. Will switching to raw improve these problems? He doesn't have any other medical issues that could be causing this, its just the way he's been since he was a pup.
    What have you been feeding so far?

    A raw diet very often will help dogs with skin conditions and overall improve their immune health. However, not all allergies are food related and raw diet may not completely help- or even help at all. A friend's dog has really bad rashes and skin irritations that were so constant she thought it must be the food. She went to grain free food, and then to raw, with little improvement. Many, many allergy tests were conducted and finally she got an answer. He's allergic to dust mites! The raw diet has helped some, but controlling dust mites is pretty difficult so despite a raw diet he is still a little itchy. She is keeping him on raw as she's seen him improve from the raw diet, and wants to give him all the help she can. I've heard many, many cases of dogs with rashes, dry skin, constantly itching, and raw works like magic to solve the issue. It's not magic for every dog as environmental factors can be playing a role too, but raw is a great start and may be the solution for your dog.
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

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  3. #242
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sibe View Post
    What have you been feeding so far?

    A raw diet very often will help dogs with skin conditions and overall improve their immune health. However, not all allergies are food related and raw diet may not completely help- or even help at all. A friend's dog has really bad rashes and skin irritations that were so constant she thought it must be the food. She went to grain free food, and then to raw, with little improvement. Many, many allergy tests were conducted and finally she got an answer. He's allergic to dust mites! The raw diet has helped some, but controlling dust mites is pretty difficult so despite a raw diet he is still a little itchy. She is keeping him on raw as she's seen him improve from the raw diet, and wants to give him all the help she can. I've heard many, many cases of dogs with rashes, dry skin, constantly itching, and raw works like magic to solve the issue. It's not magic for every dog as environmental factors can be playing a role too, but raw is a great start and may be the solution for your dog.
    Thank you very much for the extra info! I have tried to make his environment as preventative as possible based on my own knowledge, I'll look into it again in case I'm missing something.

    So far I have been feeding chicken thighs, pork shoulder, beef liver, a little bit of pork ribs, a little bit of mackerel, and a little bit of sardines. Are there certain meats I should lean more toward to improve skin and coat? I am planning on ordering from the Hare Today website for things I cannot find on my own.

    Edit: so far he has shown no digestive problems with what I have listed. The only difference I've noticed is smaller stool.
    Last edited by mzink; 12-20-2012 at 04:49 PM.

  4. #243
    Senior Member Sibe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Good variety so far! A fish oil supplement would be a good addition for Omega 3s which can really help their skin and coat. The mackerel and sardine are good as they offer some, but you'd have to feed waaay too much fish to make up the difference for what is lost in commercial non-organic meat.

    You want to give fish oil, not cod liver oil. Krill oil is also fine. Go to a pharmacy such as Walgreens or CVS. Buying pet specific supplements from a pet store or anywhere else is often not a good idea for a couple reasons. Pet supplements are usually not regulated, and certainly not to the point that human grade supplements are. Pet specific supplements can also get away with not listing every ingredient. They can therefore add ingredients that are pointless at best and harmful at worst like flavorings or chemicals.

    Go to the store and start looking at bottles. Look at the ingredients listed on the back. There should only be fish oil, gelatin, and glycerin. The gelatin and glycerin are the shell of the capsule. There should be no Vitamin E or mixed tocopherols which are usually soy; and no rosemary extract, citrus flavoring, or anything else. If you can't find any fish oil that doesn't have mixed tocopherols or Vitamin E and you don't want to order any, then I say it's fine to use it. There is very little soy in a gelcap and I think the benefits outweigh the no-no of giving soy. It's definitely best to avoid it if you can though. Currently the oil I give my girls has mixed tocopherols. If you are looking at salmon oil, make sure it clearly states it is wild salmon. Farmed salmon is to be avoided.

    Here are a couple examples of what to look for on the bottle.
    [Note: I'm not specifically promoting these brands, these are simply two examples of fish oils that are good to use and I will be using them as references for how to read the labels.]





    Ingredients are only fish oil, gelatin, and glycerin. It also specifies which fish are used.





    Dosage: Look on the BACK of the bottle for the EPA and DHA information. Do not rely on what the front of the bottle says. The maintenance dose to bring Omega 3s and 6s back into balance is to give 100mg DHA+EPA per 10lb. For example, a 100 lb dog would need 1000mg, and a 15 lb dog would need 150mg.

    On the first bottle look about 2/3 of the way down the label where it says "Fish Body Oil Concentrate." One serving size is 1760mg which is what the front of the bottle says. The next line down says 870mg of Omega 3s. That's why you need to look at the back of the bottle for the numbers, not the front! Then look at the top of the label- Serving size is 2 softgels. That means each gel is 435mg of Omega 3s. More typical is what is shown on the label of the second bottle, with each gel containing 300mg of Omega 3s.

    A 300mg gel would be the perfect daily dosage for a 30 lb dog, or two per day for a 60 lb dog, or 3 for a 90 lb dog. What if your dog is in the middle like mine are? Both my huskies weigh about 40 lbs. They would need 400mg per day. If I give them one gel per day they would end up short by 700mg for the week. So I give them an extra gel twice a week to make up the difference. It does not have to be an exact or perfect dosage.
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

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  6. #244
    Senior Member Gally's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Good info Sibe. I've been considering adding fish oil to Gally's diet now that he is fully transitioned.

  7. #245
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Wow thanks a million for all the info on the supplements! I will pick some up from walgreens. Thanks for the details on what to look for! Much appreciated!

  8. #246
    Senior Member Gally's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    How much fish would you need to feed to make fish oil not worth supplementing?

    If I'm reading the numbers right my 25lb dog would need 250mg per day or 1,750mg per week. One 100g serving of raw mackerel has 2g of omega 3. A whole mackerel that I buy weighs about 0.5lbs which is roughly 225g so about 4.5g or 4500mg of omega 3. Would one raw mackerel be more then enough omega 3? I'm confused >.<

  9. #247
    Senior Member Sibe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    I was unaware mackerel had so much. Apparently about twice as much as salmon has. I'm gonna have to dig into this more, as it's just what I've heard that you'd have to feed too much fish to make it worth it. Never actually looked up how much Omega is in a whole fish >.<
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

  10. #248
    Senior Member Kathyy's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gally View Post
    How much fish would you need to feed to make fish oil not worth supplementing?

    If I'm reading the numbers right my 25lb dog would need 250mg per day or 1,750mg per week. One 100g serving of raw mackerel has 2g of omega 3. A whole mackerel that I buy weighs about 0.5lbs which is roughly 225g so about 4.5g or 4500mg of omega 3. Would one raw mackerel be more then enough omega 3? I'm confused >.<
    That is my understanding. I figure feeding about the same fatty fish a week as organ is plenty as each type of fatty fish has its own nutrient profile.

  11. #249
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Hello MagicRe,
    Sorry i haven't check back on this thread for a while. We had a bumpy road with Charly, he enjoyed the food but his bowel disagreed and he started losing weight.
    Meanwhile we needed to board him due to vacation so he had a chemical castration, which improved his appetite a great deal and we figured it was the best time to switch diet. He has been on a grainfree pre-packaged raw diet since. And he gained 2 kgs back. Now I am not sure if it was the new diet or the hormones, but he is eating well everyday and I can't be happier. I still give him oxtail to gnawl on once a week, and sometimes a drumstick for snack, but otherwise, we stick to the new diet.
    It was a big learning experience nevertheless.

    Lastly Merry Christmas to all and happy raw feeding :-)

  12. #250
    Senior Member MagicRe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by FrenchBasset View Post
    Hello MagicRe,
    Sorry i haven't check back on this thread for a while. We had a bumpy road with Charly, he enjoyed the food but his bowel disagreed and he started losing weight.
    Meanwhile we needed to board him due to vacation so he had a chemical castration, which improved his appetite a great deal and we figured it was the best time to switch diet. He has been on a grainfree pre-packaged raw diet since. And he gained 2 kgs back. Now I am not sure if it was the new diet or the hormones, but he is eating well everyday and I can't be happier. I still give him oxtail to gnawl on once a week, and sometimes a drumstick for snack, but otherwise, we stick to the new diet.
    It was a big learning experience nevertheless.

    Lastly Merry Christmas to all and happy raw feeding :-)
    i'm glad Charly is happy and that is, after all, what counts.

    have a very Merry Christmas and yes, keep giving him some nice raw meaty bones for those teeth.....

  13. #251
    Senior Member Sibe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Beginner's Guide to Prey Model Raw. Anyone know who put this together?? It's really great.
    Beginners Guide to Prey Model Raw
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    It was put together by a person on another forum, don't think we are allowed to say which one here. She had to convince her husband the diet was good for the dog and she asked loads of questions at that forum and edited and edited. Came out quite nice.

  15. #253
    Senior Member Sibe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Great success story! But wow that is a LOT of organ, and I would not call his diet balanced at all. Why so much? His diet is almost 50% organ. Basic guideline is 80% meat, 10% organ, 10% bone which is based on the makeup of a natural prey item like a deer. Also heart is meat, not organ. Do you use boney chicken or just the meat? He needs more edible bone for calcium and other minerals. Beef ribs are pretty hard. If his diet was actually complete and balanced he wouldn't need the multivitamin either. Why does he take it?
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Hi! I've been feeding my dog with dry and canned food for a while, but after reading some reviews I decided it wasn't a good idea. So I took a decision to feed my Jack with raw food. What are the first steps to take to start feeding a dog with raw food? How to make these diet changes easier for a pet?

  17. #255
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRe View Post
    and this is spam.
    And this is back-seat moderating.

    Don't quote spam.

  18. #256
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sibe View Post
    A 300mg gel would be the perfect daily dosage for a 30 lb dog, or two per day for a 60 lb dog, or 3 for a 90 lb dog. What if your dog is in the middle like mine are? Both my huskies weigh about 40 lbs. They would need 400mg per day. If I give them one gel per day they would end up short by 700mg for the week. So I give them an extra gel twice a week to make up the difference. It does not have to be an exact or perfect dosage.
    When do you start giving the fish oil pills?

    Jake (11 years) Sparky (5 years) Firefly (2 years) Caleb (6 years) Dahlia (3 years) Andre (3 years) Gamgee (6 years) Ryuk (2 years)

  19. #257
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by kcomstoc View Post
    When do you start giving the fish oil pills?
    You can start Day 1. I didn't know about giving fish oil when I started, and I think Denali went about a year without out. She does get a bit of wild/naturally raised meat, and a whole sardine (I think technically they are pilchard since they are big) about once a week. Many people will notice how great their dog's skin and coat improve after the initial switch, then a few months in notice it's getting less soft and shiny if they're not supplementing.
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

  20. #258
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    So from puppyhood, its ok I was just wondering because I don't remember where (you'll hear this a lot from me because my memory is crap sometimes) that you have to wait a certain time to give them

    Jake (11 years) Sparky (5 years) Firefly (2 years) Caleb (6 years) Dahlia (3 years) Andre (3 years) Gamgee (6 years) Ryuk (2 years)

  21. #259
    Senior Member Sibe's Avatar
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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chasingtails View Post
    Hi, great topic. This is my first time to the forum and would love to help contribute in any way. Through my own research and feeding a number of dogs (some fussy some not), it usually depends on what foods your dog will eat. Here is a link to my page which lists all foods dogs can and cant eat and essentially sums up raw diets and BARF (biologically approved raw foods). http://www.chasingtails.info/1/post/...l#.UUq5dz2LMQs

    Thanks,

    Chasing Tails
    I disagree with some, like feeding carbs and plants as dogs have no biological need for either. A proper varied raw diet of meat, edible bones, and organs covers all the nutrition they need and is most species appropriate. You may need to add supplements like fish oil for omega 3 or others if the dog has specific health issues. Rice and potato don't give any unique nutrition and have no value to a carnivore. I also try to stay away from tuna due to mercury. Typically go for oily fish like sardine, smelt, herring, mackerel, and the like. Feeding once a day or less is perfectly fine for healthy adult dogs, you don't need to feed 2-3x a day. You do need to feed puppies often. I like the guideline that at a year old (or full grown) you can move to once a day if you want. 6-12 months feed twice a day. 4-6 months feed 3x a day. 2-4 months old, feed 4x a day. The meat does not need to be cooked in any way. That's why it's *raw* feeding. It's about feeding as natural as possible, as nature intended, and being species appropriate.
    Denali & Kaytu, 8 year old Siberian Huskies. Azuma, Silken Windhound puppy.
    RIP Amaze-Bobb, 13 year old toy poodle.

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    Re: Feeding Raw - Where to Start?

    hi guys.... im new, so if im not ment to post in here, help me find the correct place. technology is not my thing!!! doggies are .
    over the last week i have changed my danes over to raw. they had been having a raw brekky of frames or chicken necks for the longest time already. my first question is more about pickles, our 6 month old dane princess..... i had stayed with dry food for so long because danes grow so quick and are vunerable to growth problems if not fed correctly. and biccies provided peice of mind.. i measure her food and i know exactly what she is getting cos the packet tells me so!!!! however raw is a lil more in the air. how can i be certain that the raw diet i provide will give my girl everything she needs without her growing to quickly due to diet?? any advice or tips or slaps in the face greatly appreciated.

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