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Why I dont Neuter

2K views 24 replies 16 participants last post by  Laurelin 
#1 ·
I was asked to write this up by a member on another forum and I thought I would share it here as well....

I will try to make this post as comprehendible as possible but no promises…it’s been one of “those” days, if you know what I mean LOL Also before I begin I would just like to make it clear that this post is not intended to try to advocate keeping a dog intact, this is simply my own reasons for not neutering as I was asked to state in another post. Let it be known that I am all for neutering a pet dog. However, I also believe that no owner should be swayed to make the decision to neuter simply because people around them are recommending that it is the right thing to do (by moral standards only). I believe all responsible owners should find out the pros and cons to neutering and the pros and cons to leaving a dog intact before finalizing their decision.

I will leave all my dogs intact unless a genetic, health or behavioral issue arises that either needs to be fixed via neutering OR is something that I definitely do not want passed on such as deformities. By behavioral I don’t mean the dog leg-humping or marking or some other behavior that can be corrected via training, I’m talking about something along the lines of two males constantly at each other’s throats, or severe aggression in a breed that should not have any aggression such as the Siberian Husky. Here’s why…

All my sledding mentors have told me that an intact dog heals faster from illness and injury than a neutered dog. This is important to me because if one of my sled dogs gets injured somehow or falls sick I need them to get healthy again as fast as possible so they can get back in harness and keep racing. Plus, as I have stated in the past, every dog that I own will be a working dog so again, if one of them gets sick or injured I need them to heal quickly to get them back to doing their job. Granted thus far this has not been provided to me as medical fact, only countless numbers of years working with literally 100s if not 1000s of different dogs. I am planning on asking my vet about this particular matter soon and I will also be taking this to Guelph University (one of the best universities for veterinary medicines and agriculture) to find out what they have to say on the matter. None the less though, I trust my mentors and take what they have to say very seriously so even if the vet studies come back inconclusive this point will still stick with me.

No one can be 100% sure on whether a dog is worthy of being bred or not until they are fully mature which doesn’t happen until at least 2 years of age and sometimes later for some breeds. With this in mind I don’t believe in neutering a dog before at least 2 years when it can be properly evaluated. They need those hormones for proper growth as well. Dogs neutered early result in the lack of those crucial hormones which can have adverse effects in the way that they grow such as males looks feminine and females appearing too dog-ish.

"Castration weakens all dogs to some degree." So says Leon F. Whitney, D.V.M. He goes on to explain: "Castration, whether of dogs or bitches, produces marked changes over the normal. The earlier the operation is performed, the more marked are the changes.” Taken from http://www.courageouscaucasians.com/neutering.htm

Neutered animals also do gain weight faster than intact ones due to excess water retention. While this can be controlled with diet and exercise, I need my guys to be able to take in extra fat and protein and not have it turned into fat but FUEL. I’m constantly battling with OC’s weight trying to find the comfort zone between providing him with enough calories to perform optimally with sledding and not having his body simply taking it in and adding to his waist.

Yes neutering can decrease the chances of cancers such as testicular cancer and mammary cancer, but it can also INCREASE the chances of bone cancer and others. Also it makes the dogs more susceptible to viruses. Progesterone is a more powerful anti-inflammatory than even cortisone and neutering lowers the level of progesterone. The same thing happens in women who go through menopause. Women who were very healthy post-menopause suddenly become effected by immune-mediated diseases and cancers. For more information on this check this site out http://www.dogtorj.net/id57.html Thank you to Kayla from Chazhound for showing me this link.

Even though neutering is a common surgery using just a general anesthesia there is ALWAYS a risk with it. All my future dogs will be carefully selected for their working ability and at times this may mean I got the chance of a life time pup perhaps from a very remote breeder who usually keeps their pups or only gives to very close friends. I’m not going to risk losing a pup on a table for a surgery it doesn’t even necessarily need.

“…keeping him intact may serve a purpose: maintaining his maximum musculature as he ages to help deal with the muscle loss that comes from the inevitable arthritis.” Taken from http://www.dolittler.com/index.cfm/2006/11/26/pet.vet.dog.cat.vs101.11.26.06

Not only is keeping a dog’s musculature important for potential eventual loss of muscle, it is also important for the dog to perform optimally. I don’t really care about the muscles for the looks. Sure a ripped dog looks awesome but I’m not after the appearance, I’m after the practicality. And besides, the breeds I am most interested in have double-coats so you can’t really see the musculature anyways LOL

I believe I have covered all my reasons for leaving my dogs intact, if I have missed any and think of them later I will be sure to post them. It is important to remember that many people including many vets and breeders have a bias to neutering so they will try to push it upon you. When trying to find information regarding neutering look for people who have an unbiased opinion or at least will give you all the facts straight up. It has been my observations through doing these studies that often if someone gives the only pros to leaving a dog intact to be “showing purposes and breeding” they either have a bias or they are simply uneducated or perhaps even ignorant. It would be wise to take what they say with a grain of salt and continue on with your research.

If you do decide to leave your dog intact, remember it comes with a huge responsibility!!! Some precautions to take are:

- do not let them wander around areas that could have bitches in heat
- do not allow unsupervised interacting between intact males and unspayed females even if they aren’t in heat (some heats are very subtle so she could be in heat and her owner just hasn’t noticed)
- keep the dogs securely confined and males separate from females especially during heats
- keep the dogs on leash when outside of fenced areas
- know your female’s heat cycle and do not let her out of your site during and after ovulation
- be smart

There are exceptions to the rules at times such as, it would not be reasonable to keep an intact livestock guarding dog behind a fence all the time when his job is to protect a free-roaming flock of sheep from predators. Or if you own an intact male and female and know for sure that the female is not in heat. Like the last point says, just be smart about it. Use common sense and you shouldn’t have any problems :)

If you have any questions regarding anything I have written please ask me about it and ask me to clarify and dont just point fingers and start accussing as I have had happen before on forums from people who obviously just like to start trouble. Oh ya and please dont throw all kinds of ""why I shuld neuter"" websites at me, I have read them, I know the reasons, after all they were part of my research and decision making before I came to the conclusion I have. This is all my opinion, not something I am trying to preach to others. Take it as you will.
 
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#2 ·
Good for you.
You have done the research and come to your own conclusions.

There are not enough people who are willing to find out WHY we do things the way we do, and look into the pro's and con's of both decisions.

All of my cats and dogs are spayed or neutered, but none of them are of breeding quality, nor are they performance animals.

You are an asset to the dog forums community, and with open minded thinking like yours, you give me a little more faith in people :)

Thank you for your post, I loved it.

Meghan
 
#3 ·
I''m glad you enjoyed it!!!

My open-mindedness can be a blessing and a burden LOL I tend to ask ""why"" a lot and sometimes teachers would simply rather I blindly believe what the text book says rather than having to prove it...

Another great link to look at! Although this deals more with early VS later neutering as opposed to whether or not to neuter at all...Still has some very valid points to consider though!

http://caninesports.com/SpayNeuter.html
 
#5 ·
Interesting post. I don't neuter all my males either and right now we have two intact- both show dogs though. To me it really isn't a problem for those who are responsible enough to keep intact dogs apart and from breeding. I've had an intact bitch in heat and an intact dog at once (only one heat) and it wasn't difficult at all to prevent unwanted pregnancies. We kept one in one room and one in another and supervised them at all times. I would like to think that people keep their dogs under control and supervised at all times anyways. However, I do feel that many people do not do this and as a result it's probably best to keep the majority of dogs altered. Like I said, we have two altered and two intact. All our 'just pets' dogs are fixed and the intact males kept in line.
 
#6 ·
Everyone here is speutered, because they are either rescues or mixed breeds. ( Meik is neither, but he is a family pet not a 100% working dog)
Its my preference to spay/neuter my dogs, but I do understand why working dogs(or athletes) may not be, and as said earilier, being smart about it makes the world of a difference.
I encourage EVERYONE to spay or neuter who has a family pet. If they are not show dogs, field or sporting dogs, working dogs ect.
Family pets dont need to be intact. IMO.
 
#9 ·
Ren, your a responsible dog woman. While I know you don't show your dogs, you work them all a lot, in the sport that the dog was intended to work in. A CH. title to some is not as much of a reason as having a hardworking dog that excells in the sport they were bred for.

If either Ronin or OC show what in the sled world is desired, you are more than responsible enough and not naive to make the decision to breed irrationally.

The reason my guys are s/n first off is they are not "purebreds". And even if either of them excelled in OB, or eventually agility or even perhaps SchH, I would never dream of breeding either of them.

I think most people who own pets, should neuter. Mainly because, no offense to people on this board, but they DO not take the proper precautions while owning an intact dog. On top of that, the behavioural issues that CAN be dealt with with training, can be bothersome for an average pet owner, does not have the time or the ambition to train their dog to cease them.

As said above, there is nothing wrong with having an intact dog if you plan on acting responsibly. With that being said, the average pet owner should s/n. Mixes should be s/n. If you want to wait the 14 months until the dog is fully matured, make sure your ready to be responsible enough during that time.

The difference with you Ren, is your not a yahoo, average dog owner. You work and train with your dogs on a regular basis. You are more than knowledgable about dogs and definitely about your sport. And your not about to let your dog's loose and have unwanted litters, or even breed before your absolutely sure that your dogs have traits that will better the working aspect of your breed ;) None of that crappy show Sibe crap :D ROFL
 
#10 ·
WimbleWoof, currently I own 1 male neutered Siberian Husky, and 1 male intact Siberian Husky and then I work alongside two kennels or working Siberian Huskies, one owns 9 and the other owns 20, all of them intact and a mix of males and females.

Alpha, some very good points and I agree ;) Like I said in my OP, I''m not here to try to convince the average joe to not neuter his pet, Im just here to shed light on the side of the story that often gets left in the dark.
 
#12 ·
I think most people who own pets, should neuter.
I'll take that one step further and say that anyone who owns pets should neuter. Working dogs (and I include show dogs as working dogs) aren't just pets. If all someone wants is a loveable companion to go for walks or hikes, play outside and snuggle on the couch, there's no reason to have it intact (and sorry, guys, but fear of losing one's own testicles and projecting that fear upon a dog is not a good reason ;) ), and a lot of good reasons to spay & neuter. But for a responsible person with working dogs, I can understand why they don't.
 
#22 ·
Well said and I completely agree.

It doesn't usually take a keen eye to tell the difference between an altered grey and an unaltered grey...one of the first things that happens is they "drop their back" - lose the definition of their powerful muscles on either side of their spine. They'll also lose the definition and some muscle mass in their strong booty muscles. I have to bust my butt to keep my lure coursing dogs with good muscle tone...and even when I think they look "just as great as a track dog" we get a load of track dogs in and they are just amazingly ripped and I can see the difference quite easily LOLOL :rolleyes:

But we just participate in lure coursing for fun, so any performance loss due to spay/neuter is really irrelevant. Besides...most of the other greyhounds competing are also retired racers and have been altered so the playing field is pretty level in that respect. When we 'branch out' and add a whippet or other sighthound to the mix, we may not alter. Most likely we will, but maybe not. And we definitely won't alter at a young age, since we do want a performance hound.
 
#13 ·
i agree w/ OC on the s/n aspect.....it would be perfect if everyone could/would be like this if they kept their dogs intact but unfortunately, the majority of the people are not that "responsible".....and also, unfortunately, as BritishBandit found out the hard way, do not EVER trust anyone else to be responsible for your dogs (and i sometimes feel that way whether intact or not) for any length of time (yes, BB, i believe what you wrote on the other post about your "friend")....

right now, i have 4 BC's....3 are s/n and the other is intact and will be till she proves to me that she shouldn't be.....at the same time, i "puppysit" an intact GR 3 nights a wk and when the time comes that Tir is in season again (w/in the next 2-3 wks) there will be some drastic changes around the house.....and i see no reason not to continue taking care of him during this time....

but, the majority of the people out there would be better off s/n as they don't take the time to be diligent about watching.....
 
#15 ·
Way to go OC_Spirit...I think it's people like you have no problem with having intact dogs! :) IMO anyone who is resposible with their dogs could go either way on the issue. It's really the people who don't know much about dogs, or who carelessly breed their dogs that need to only have spayed/neutered animals. For me I'd probably never have an intact pet, but that's only because I don't have or at this point plan to have working dogs. I absolutely agree with everyone here though in that if you have a pet it really ought to be spayed/neutered because you never know...but for working dogs (including show dogs) if you're going to do the research and be responsible go for it! :) Great post and great job on the research! I was impressed! :) Oh and one question...do show dogs have to be intact? I mean a lot of people who have show dogs want to breed them, but I a was watching the Westminster show and wondered...
 
#20 · (Edited)
Oh and one question...do show dogs have to be intact? I mean a lot of people who have show dogs want to breed them, but I a was watching the Westminster show and wondered...
For the majority of classes yes and for showing in general, but often specialties (which is an entire show devoted to one breed of dog) will have an ""altered class"" for the neutered guys ;) You can still CH your dog through these classes it just takes more time since there usually aren''t too many specialties for some breeds.

Keno''s Mum, currently I dont breed myself at all ;) But if I do ever decide to have a litter then I would decide whether a pup should be neutered based on how it has turned out and where it is going. Although I would likely recommend to my puppy buyers to not have them neutered until at least two. I''m incredibly picky when it comes to who would get a puppy from me, to begin with I will only sell to WORKING HOMES unless a pup really shows that it has no drive to do any work, so right there, often the working dog people are already more educated than the average pet owner and I know I can trust them to keep an intact dog responsibly.
 
#17 ·
Ah, I kinda figured that was the case, but wasn't sure. I doubt I'll ever have a show dog...but I've alwaya thought it would be fun to do it sometime...maybe learn about it and show someone's dog...it'd be a good experience.
 
#18 ·
The idea behind this is that the entire point of showing is to test breedworthiness of your stock so it'd be rather pointless to show an altered dog. So for that reason all conformation dogs must be intact.
 
#19 · (Edited)
I see your point. But the sad truth is there are not very many "responsbile" people like yourself that would take all those precautions and insure your dogs are kept healthy and not breeding anytime they want.

Its called a "good" breeder. That is why most of us try to encouage the average pet owner to spay/neuter their pets asap because there are too many "accidents" and then no homes for these pups and the shelter gets to do the dirty work!

Also very few average people will even test their dogs before breeding.

I commend your honesty and see you are a good breeder who really cares about your dogs and wants the best.

One quick question - when you do breed and sell pups you don't keep, do you have the owner spay and neuter those pets?



In the cat fancy we do have a separate show class for pedigree altered cats. While you can't breed them, they are top quality as the championship cats (sometimes more so as they hold coat better). It STILL reflects on the quality of the breeder to produce top cats whether they are entire or neutered.

I don't see why the dog fancy can't do the same thing. You would still get credit as a breeder to produce top quality dogs :)
 
#21 ·
Hey it is the things I was never told well I was being told to clip my poor boy.... They are long gone now
 
#23 ·
I have heard that intact dogs heal faster then a non-intact dog. But some of the other things in your post were very interesting. I will have to do some more research into that. Very informative, thanks!
 
#24 ·
I have a 2 year old un-neutered boxer. He is not breeding quality as his nose is too long and his head too square, besides I don't really want to breed him.

Why don't I neuter him? Like OC_Spirit mentioned any surgery is taking a risk.
The way I see it, it's a risk either way, so for me I'd rather the risk be the way nature intended it, not medical practice.

I am a very responsible pet owner, I have a large fenced yard, I know all the dogs in my neighbourhood (what sex, age, and status), and always leash my dog (unless in dog parks). The chances of him getting a Bitch pregnant is unlikely, but IF he did, I would take full responsibility.
 
#25 ·
Oh, I also forgot, you can show veterans altered in specialties, but that's about all the altered dogs you'll see at shows. Most of them are already champed and already bred anyways.
 
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