DIY: Puppy cut
DogForums.com is the premier dog Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: DIY: Puppy cut

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    55

    DIY: Puppy cut

    I am going to attempt to be a Do it yourself(er). I want to maintain a puppy cut. Is that difficult to do? Do I really need a special table and 'noose stand'?

    I bought some clippers today but I am entertaining comments from the field.

    http://www.andis.com/USA/sm_animal/p...ades_chart.pdf

  2. Remove Advertisements
    DogForums.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    Senior Member briteday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    6,066

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    What breed is the dog?
    Being smart is learning from your own mistakes. Being wise is learning from others' mistakes.
    Cally- 14 yo papillon, Moose the puppy, McKenna 8 yo pomeranian grand-dog, and chickens

  4. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    55

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Quote Originally Posted by briteday View Post
    What breed is the dog?
    He's a Bichon Frise' - 1 year old.

    His puppy cut makes him look like a white Golden Retriever puppy.

  5. #4
    Senior Member poodleholic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Gulf Coast of FL
    Posts
    3,700

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Quote Originally Posted by titaniummd View Post
    He's a Bichon Frise' - 1 year old.

    His puppy cut makes him look like a white Golden Retriever puppy.


    With no training or experience, I wouldn't advise you to even attempt this on your own! You could injure your puppy. Professionals are skilled in using clippers and shears, and in working with a wriggly puppy, or one who isn't real cooperative.

    I've learned to groom my Standard Poodles, but, over time. I purchased the appropriate professional equipment I'd need, because to attempt to clip and trim your dog with the junk available in pet stores is an exercise in futility!

    Talk with your current groomer to see if s/he would be willing to give you lessons on how to groom your dog, and to tell you what tools and equipment you're going to need. You may have a clipper in hand, but if you use the blade it came with, you're going to have a skinned dog, or with bald spots here and there!

    There are how-to videos/DVDs out there for the very motivated, and these can be very helpful.

  6. #5
    Senior Member Dieselsmama's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Posts
    3,510

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Quote Originally Posted by titaniummd View Post
    He's a Bichon Frise' - 1 year old.

    His puppy cut makes him look like a white Golden Retriever puppy.
    You will have to invest in some fairly expensive equipment to be able to do this yourself at home. You'll also need instruction from someone who knows what they're doing like your groomer. Some of the things you'll need that are a MUST have to perform a puppy cut on a bichon are: grooming table ( around 100-150) , high velocity dryer ( these range in price from 200-well over a thousand dollars for professional models) good clippers ( 100-200) blades, you'll need a 10 for clipping out excess hair btween pads and overe the groin area and maybe a 3 or 4 depending on the length you want if you plan to clip the body, I usually recommend 2-3 blades of each size that way you have backups for when one gets dull and needs to be sent out for sharpening ( 20-40 each) scissors ( around 75-300 for a quite nice pair) slicker brush (10ish) greyhound comb ( 10-20) nail clippers (10-20) styptic powder for a nail cut too short (10). I am sure I am forgetting some other stuff, this is assuming you already can bathe the dog in your tub with a handheld shower attachment.
    **sig too big**

  7. #6
    Super Moderator RonE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Two Rivers, WI
    Posts
    10,249

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Never having owned a dog who needed haircuts, this might be a silly question. But why would a professional groomer be willing to teach someone to do it at home?
    Last edited by RonE; 12-20-2007 at 10:36 AM.

  8. #7
    Senior Member FriendsOfZoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Boston, MA
    Posts
    2,243

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Quote Originally Posted by Dieselsmama View Post
    Some of the things you'll need that are a MUST have to perform a puppy cut on a bichon are...
    Well I'm sure there are ways to make this list less expensive. For instance, I've seen places that sell an arm/loop attachment for a pre-existing table. There are dryers for around 50 that might not be show quality, but would get the job done. I don't know much about clippers, but I can say that a slicker brush shouldn't cost more than 10 bucks; neither should nail clippers, and you can use all-purpose flour for nails rather than styptic powder. AP Flour is like 2 dollars for 5 pounds or something, and it works like a charm.

    Of course, it's still going to be expensive to buy everything to self-groom a bichon, but it probably won't take long for the OP to start saving money he would have spent at the groomers. Also, he's grooming one dog, not running a professional grooming business, so I bet he'd be okay buying some cheaper supplies, at least at first, and seeing if he needs to invest in more expensive clippers, etc. later on. I'd be more concerned about learning to do it properly.

  9. #8
    Senior Member Dieselsmama's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Posts
    3,510

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Quote Originally Posted by FriendsOfZoe View Post
    Well I'm sure there are ways to make this list less expensive. For instance, I've seen places that sell an arm/loop attachment for a pre-existing table. There are dryers for around 50 that might not be show quality, but would get the job done. I don't know much about clippers, but I can say that a slicker brush shouldn't cost more than 10 bucks; neither should nail clippers, and you can use all-purpose flour for nails rather than styptic powder. AP Flour is like 2 dollars for 5 pounds or something, and it works like a charm.

    Of course, it's still going to be expensive to buy everything to self-groom a bichon, but it probably won't take long for the OP to start saving money he would have spent at the groomers. Also, he's grooming one dog, not running a professional grooming business, so I bet he'd be okay buying some cheaper supplies, at least at first, and seeing if he needs to invest in more expensive clippers, etc. later on. I'd be more concerned about learning to do it properly.

    A bichon has a coat similar to a poodles. To be able to groom it you need to blow dry the coat straight, Therefore you DO need a HV dryer. I've yet to find one that can perform this under $200. I never said a slicker brush would be more than $10, I believe I said 10ish, which could go either side of $10, there are some fancy ones that are more, but wouldn't necessarily do any better job than a standard pair, Ditto for the nail clippers. You also can certainly use the arm and noose attachment for an existing table, but it would need to be a surface that a) can get wet ( from blowing out the coat) b) would have some sort of rubberized type grips so the dog has sure footing and doesn't slip and c) is an appropriate height (when you're scissoring this becomes more important ). You're right, sometimes flour will do for a bleeding nail, but on occasion it's not quite enough and styptic powder is preferable. The main problem with buying cheaper clippers is that the blades are often not interchangeable and cannot be sharpened, therefore you're stuck with one very short length or using blade combs which unless you're a fairly experienced person using them, it's quite easy for them to pop off and then you have bald spots. Most clippers that are middle of the road as far as quality will run at least $100. Finally I do agree with you that learning how to groom the dog should be first priority.

    Quote Originally Posted by RonE View Post
    Never having owned a dog who needed haircuts, this might be a silly question. But why would a professional groomer be willing to teach someone to do it at home?
    Not silly at all. Most groomers I know have no problem teaching an owner to groom at home. More often than not most people learn what is really involved, how time consuming, often messy, and all the things they would need to purchase to be able to do this at home and are more than happy to bring their little furbabies in for someone else to deal with it. Not to mention the fact that scissoring is an art, it's not something every Tom **** or Harry can master, at least not without a LOT of practise
    Last edited by Dieselsmama; 12-20-2007 at 03:43 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    **sig too big**

  10. #9
    Senior Member Love's_Sophie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    2,838

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Hmmmm...not sure how he is groomed to make him look like a Golden Retriever puppy, but I am guessing the current groomer must not leave his head the way it should be left for a Bichon.

    You certainly could learn how to groom your own dog; it will take time though, especially if you want to make him look somewhat decent when you are done. The hardest part to learn is the scissoring; anyone can learn how to clip a dog well, for the most part, but it's the scissoring that is an 'art' so to speak.

    To limit the amount of scissoring, you could get a clipper that allows for detachable blades, and acquire a 5\8s blade; this is a nice length for a puppy cut. It is actually a favorite length for a lot of my clients, and when you use your clippers properly, you will have minimal scissoring to do after the clip job.

    I do suggest buying proper equipment from a grooming supply store, like groomer's choice (groomerschoice.com). Poor equipment is a pain in the neck, as the clippers can wind up not working, the scissors dull quickly, and you wind up with a dog 'half done'!

    Also, if you can, I would suggest going to a groomer and have them show you hands on what to do; perhaps they will even allow you to use their space to groom your dog, or atleast to bath and dry him there; I allow people to bath and dry their dogs for a minimal fee at my shop.

  11. #10
    Senior Member briteday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    6,066

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I've groomed all of my own dogs for the last 20 years, from cocker spaniel to poodle to papillon to pom. I've also groomed all my foster dogs at home as well...shih tzu, maltese, wheaten terrier (I don't suggest that one for beginners!),... And all have been done with the same 20 year old cheapo clippers from the pet store. I probably paid $15 for them that long ago. I will admit I am in the market for new clippers soon, but I do believe I've gotten my $15 worth out of them!

    No one has ever gotten hurt. In the beginning my own dogs looked a little weird at times. But I would do a little, then see something else to work on, do a little more...and within a few months I could get it down to being done in one sitting. It just takes plenty of practice and a ton of common sense. I'm not claiming that my dogs always look professionally groomed when I've worked on them, but I've had some pretty awful professional groomers do them and paid a whole lot more.

    It all depends on how professional the OP wants the dog to look. If he is just interested in keeping the dog in a short coat he may not even be interested in blowing it out. And although it takes longer I blow out my neighbor's poodle every 6 weeks with my own human-used hair dryer and a couple of varying sizes of slicker brushes. They just want her to have a short cut all over with pretty ears.

    My clippers are actually Osters. They came with a #10 blade and blade guards. Initially I used the blade guards but have since purchased a few extra blades instead. I probably clip one dog per month in the winter time and one dog per week in the summer. My blades have been sharpened twice. The guy who sharpens mine showed me how to oil them properly and keep them adjusted. (My current dogs require very little clipping, so it's usually just the neighbor's dogs and fosters)

    So I have $15 in clippers, another $50 in blades (may not be necessary depending on OP's expectations), $10 in a decent pair of scissors, $20 in a trimmer that works ok around the privates, cleaning the poodle face, and in between pads , $10 for nail clippers, just bought a no-name rotary tool for $20 and like it better for nails than clippers, $5 for some styptic, already had a pin brush for daily grooming, already own the hair dryer, good shampoo and conditioner can be expensive but I share a concentrated bottle with my neighbor so it cost me about $15 up front when we ordered and it will last for many YEARS. And for all those 20 years the dogs have stood on a countertop on a rubber bath mat to prevent slipping. I've had a few nippy ones when it comes to feet and so I had my husband install a hook in the ceiling over the counter. So I can attach an adjustable lead to hang from the ceiling to hold the dog's head up and prevent nipping while I work.

    Although I've accumulated the equipment over 20 years I'll bet someone can get started with clippers, scissors, nail trimmer, a few brushes, styptic, and some shampoo for about $100. That's twice around the block, two month's worth of grooming at our local groomer for a bichon, at $50 a pop. Or even if you went with better clippers, $150 to start.

    My favorite place to purchase all my grooming stuff is Petedge.com. And before I start a dog that is a new breed to me I always look at a couple of grooming books from the library and follow along as I groom them the first time. I think DIY'ers can do it if they watch/read/learn, be patient, go slow, and use common sense. And don't expect to be a pro the first time out.
    Being smart is learning from your own mistakes. Being wise is learning from others' mistakes.
    Cally- 14 yo papillon, Moose the puppy, McKenna 8 yo pomeranian grand-dog, and chickens

  12. #11
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    17

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Well i'm a groomer and i'd be willing to teach someone how to do their own grooming. In fact i have. I have a Shih tzu thats been coming for years and the owner just couldnt afford it anymore and asked if i'd be willing to show him how to do nails, pluck ears, basic clippering with a snap on comb. I didnt mind doing it for him just so he could maintain his dog and he just brings her to me now for speacial occasions...ie Xmas etc

  13. #12
    Senior Member poodleholic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Gulf Coast of FL
    Posts
    3,700

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Never having owned a dog who needed haircuts, this might be a silly question. But why would a professional groomer be willing to teach someone to do it at home?
    Many won't, however, those who are willing, charge for lessons. Some people will continue to learn how to groom their dog, others will say forget it, because of the work involved, and/or they discover they have no talent at grooming, so bring the dog back to the groomer, as they prefer their dog to look good!

    Equipment and tools can be expensive. For a Bichon, a HV dryer is a must, if the owner wants the finished groom to look right. Their hair, as with a Poodle's, has to stand up in order to scissor and clip it so that it looks decent. A cheapo dryer doesn't cut it. I know, I tried to get away with it, but finally bought my K9 II HV dryer on sale for $349. Worth every penny! Saves me time, effort, and energy, on top of making my Poodles look great.

    So I have $15 in clippers, another $50 in blades (may not be necessary depending on OP's expectations),
    Maybe you do have a $15 clipper, and only spent $50 in blades, and $10 for a scissor, but this is unrealistic today, and, there is no way a person can get a polished, professional finish using clippers from a pet store.

    I have an Andis UltraEdge 2 speed clipper, and blades run $25 each and up. I also have the Wahl Moser cordless trimmer. The Andis clipper cost around $124 on sale, the Moser $118, with its replacement blade running around $18. I use the Moser for shaving face, feet, base of tail, tummy, and sanitary. I wouldn't touch my dogs with a $10 scissor! LOL Couldn't buy an appropriate scissor for that (or even get them sharpened)! I paid $200 for my 10" straights, and more for the curved. You get what you pay for, and the results are there to see on the dog!

  14. #13
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    17

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I agree Poodleholic. Grooming equipment is expensive. I work inside a Vets clinic that is fully equipt but i started last year to collect my own supplies. Ive slowly gotten most things i need but still need a really good pair of shears. I made the mistake of buying not the cheapest but not overly expensive. I hate them..they are heavy and don't work for me. What a waste of money. Next time i wont make the same mistake.
    Last edited by snowflake; 12-22-2007 at 05:58 PM.

  15. #14
    Senior Member briteday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    6,066

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I think you need to understand that the home groomer with only one dog looks at equipment differently than a professional. The ergonomics of professional grade equipment isn't as critical if you are only grooming once/month at the most. And maybe the OP doesn't have expectations of their dog looking professionally scissored all the time. I found, when I first started doing my own dogs, that it helped to pay for a professional grooming each Spring as it helped me keep the coat in the correct shape during the rest of the year.

    Just yesterday at a local dog store I saw some Wahl clippers (whole set of stuff with a video, blade guards, oil, brush, #10 blade) for <$30. OK, not for the professional, but that's the kind of thing I started out with and they have served me well over the years with many dogs. I admit that I am looking for "more professioanl" clippers because the neighbor poodle and a couple of recent fosters took me longer to groom than I would like. And I would imagine a bichon would be the same as the poodle. But the OP listed a link to some Andis clippers he was considering so I think he's on the right track there.

    I think the most dangerous aspect of home grooming is taking out the clippers, with the #10 blade that most come with, and thinking that you can just start clipping. I did such a close shave on my first dog with those things that you could have done sterile surgery on her! But they didn't have all the neat videos and books easily available 20 years ago. I would suggest that anyone starting out spend some time observing a pro, reading, and watching some videos for reinforcement. And use the blade guards or buy some extra blades.

    I'm not a professional, but neither is the OP. However, I think it would be great if some of the pros could suggest a "reasonable" selection of clippers, keeping in mind that they are only pulled out once/month and cost is a big factor. Reasonable in quality (mid-grade, interchange blades), price (we're not making money off these things so they are not a financial asset to us), and durability (we need them to last more than two groomings, even if we don't have a deep understanding of exactly how to use them in a professional manner).

    I need new clippers. And I will need a selection of general use blades when a # 10 is way too close, and guards/combs only become tangles in the fur. Although I have access to the info I think it would be great if a pro could break down the blade size related to the finished length of the coat. Suggestions???
    Being smart is learning from your own mistakes. Being wise is learning from others' mistakes.
    Cally- 14 yo papillon, Moose the puppy, McKenna 8 yo pomeranian grand-dog, and chickens

  16. #15
    Senior Member lovemygreys's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    3,437

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I'd ask a groomer to show me how to do it...and be willing to pay for the lesson(s).

    That said, this is why I own short haired dogs LOL
    Heather and the hounds ~ www.worldofgrey.com
    http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3560/3526368682_a6c66d5b5f_o.jpg
    Make a fast friend, Adopt a Greyhound!

  17. #16
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    17

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I'm a groomer and both my dogs are short haired.I have a Boston Terrier and an English Bulldog. When i'm at home i don't want to deal with hair.

    http://www.petgroomer.com/groomingbasics101.htm
    scroll down, pick youre breed and it tells you what blades to use. I do stray a little from some of this info but it depends on the dogs hair and what the client wants. For instance if the client has a Schnauzer but wants a longer length for the winter i wouldnt use a #10 back. I'd probably go with a #7
    heres the blades and the lengths of them
    #3= 1/2"
    #4= 3/8"
    #5= 1/4"
    #7= 1/8"
    #8 1/2= 7/64" (short)
    #9= 7/64" (shorter)
    #10= 1/16" (shorter still)
    #15= 3/64" (for really matted coats) or those clients who don't want to groom thier dogs to often...lol
    #40+ 1/100" (surgical)
    Last edited by snowflake; 12-22-2007 at 06:14 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  18. #17
    Senior Member briteday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    6,066

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    Thank you for the website. I have a grooming book that I refer to. I have a lot of elderly neighbors who can no longer bathe and brush out their dogs. Many do not require clipping or scissoring, but a few do. It's nice to see all the info in one place. Thanks!
    Being smart is learning from your own mistakes. Being wise is learning from others' mistakes.
    Cally- 14 yo papillon, Moose the puppy, McKenna 8 yo pomeranian grand-dog, and chickens

  19. #18
    Senior Member poodleholic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Gulf Coast of FL
    Posts
    3,700

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I'm not a professional, but neither is the OP. However, I think it would be great if some of the pros could suggest a "reasonable" selection of clippers, keeping in mind that they are only pulled out once/month and cost is a big factor. Reasonable in quality (mid-grade, interchange blades), price (we're not making money off these things so they are not a financial asset to us), and durability (we need them to last more than two groomings, even if we don't have a deep understanding of exactly how to use them in a professional manner).
    I'm not a professional groomer, either, but, my grooming equipment is a financial asset because, by doing the grooming myself, the equipment saved me money, and over time has paid for itself. A shave down for a Standard Poodle where I live is a minimum cost of $65 for each dog (providing you can find a groomer who will even take a Standard - they can do 4 small dogs in the time it takes to do one Standard Poodle).

    I feel that a good quality clipper is essential, especially for someone who is just learning. Paying $124 for a good clipper is a very reasonable cost when you figure the cost every month at the groomer's. It would pay for itself in a few months.

  20. #19
    Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    30

    Re: DIY: Puppy cut

    I'm very disappointed to see that some here would rather discourage someone from grooming their dog instead of offering helpful suggestions. I was on this forum about a year ago (I believe) and got a LOT of help and encouragement to groom my own dog. So I will offer my experience.

    I have a male Shih-tzu. I am basically the only one around here who brushes and combs him and he loves it. I figured he would sit pretty good for me while being clipped and I was right. Not too sure how it would have gone if he didn't.

    I spent about $200 from Petedge.com It was suggested to me to buy a quality single speed clipper. Of course thst suggestion bounced back and forth until someone finally explained why. Professional groomer do many dogs a day and move quickly over the dog not allowing the blades to become too hot. A fast speed clipper creates more friction and becomes hotter faster than a slower speed. The slower speed is plenty fast to cut even a problem dog and will not heat up as fast as the faster speed. Therefore I purchased an Andis AD #22350 seels now for $109

    http://www.petedge.com/Andis-AGC-Sin...er-AD22350.pro

    It comes with a #10 blade and I also purchased a #30 blade as well as an Oster comb attachment kit. Came with 7 different sizes. A few people bcak then and still now seem to think that comb attachments are dangerous to use. I have had nothing but great results and no problems. I was more afraid of cutting with a blade against the skin than using the combs. I think they ran $18 but I only found a stainless steel set on Petedge that will probably hold up better than the plastic.

    http://www.petedge.com/catalog/searc...%20attachments

    I started with a blade longer than I thought I would need to see how the lenghth was and went shorter until I found the lenghth I like. I now use the 1/2" comb over his whole body including the top of his head and from his whiskers down his chin. I shape it round under his chin and have very little scissoring to do when I am done. I use 1/4" comb on his butt and down his legs and a just used for the first time 1/8" across the tops of his feet. I try hard to have these different lenghths blend where they meet. I use a #30 on his pads.
    Top Performance 7.5" curved ball end scissors. (The ball end seems much safer to use and is also good for trimming between the pads if you don't use the clippers for that). $24
    A nail clipper. Powder was only $3.49
    Ear powder
    Clipper oil
    Andis blade care dip (hardly use)
    Coat Handler 15-1 Conditioner
    Coat Handler 5-1 Maintenance Shampoo.

    Love the shampoo and conditioner and the costs of those were in that initial order.

    So for under $200 I think I got some quality products to do one dog every 4 weeks or so. I don't have 3 of each blade for when my blade gets dull. That suggestion is ludicrous for the homeowner. I expect this to be the only clipper I ever buy and I expect the blades to last a very long time.

    I put him on a small folding table (Costco) and a tub mat on top to keep him from sliding around. No noose.

    My groomer gave me some advice over the phone and told me outright that he expects me back. That was almost a year ago. He definitely does a better job. The face has been the toughest thing for me to get looking right and I'm still not there yet. My wife thinks I'm doing a great job. My dog was always overdue when we brought him to the groomers. I would bathe him inbetween and tried to brush him regularly, but he sure needed a haircut by the time he got to the groomers. Now I bathe him every 2 weeks and clip him every 4 weeks (OK so I fall behind sometimes) A professional cut??? I doubt it. But he sure looks good and beats the expense and travel time to bring him to the groomers.

    I stood in Petco watching dogs being groomed. They do it right out front and don't mind you watching. I've even asked plenty of questions and they don't seem to mind answering. I even brought my dog in for them to see after my PROUD first clip and they gave me some suggestions.

    So I say go for it!!! Look for other forums where you can get more help. Look for specific breed info on the net. I found sites for clipping shih-tzus specifically.
    I don't get on this site much anymore but feel free to email me at
    **dangerous to post email address in post, can PM instead through forum**

    Check out this thread. It has pictures of my first clip dated March 1. Toby was already a couple of weeks overdue and probably should have gone to the groomer first so that I could just keep up on him instead of diving in with him in this shape.

    http://www.dogforums.com/4-dog-groom...-did-went.html (Well I did it and it went well!)
    Last edited by briteday; 01-03-2008 at 12:53 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  21. Remove Advertisements
    DogForums.com
    Advertisements
     

+ Reply to Thread

Quick Reply Quick Reply

  • Decrease Size
    Increase Size
  • Remove Text Formatting
  • Insert Link Insert Image Insert Video
  • Wrap [QUOTE] tags around selected text

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
SEO by vBSEO 3.5.2 ©2010, Crawlability, Inc.