Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?
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Thread: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

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    Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    This could be either a food or health issue, but my question is about food so I put it here.

    Up until this morning Topaz was eating Oma's Pride turkey mix (70% meat/bone, 10% organ meats (liver/hearts/gizzards), 20% vegetables (green been, yellow squash ,okra) with canned pumpkin and cottage cheese in it for breakfast and in the evening we've been feeding chicken backs.

    I am thinking he's going to need a more bland meal for a little while and I'd like to keep it ground for the morning so we can mix his meds in it if at all possible. And something easily accessible at either the grocery store would be wonderful.

    Does anyone have any suggestions or advice as to what we should be feeding him until he's feeling better...the vet, of course, is leery of the "salmonella" and had no suggestions. So I'm here to ask the "experts".

    I think the owner of the store where we buy our raw food from also said something about chicken backs being to fatty (less meat, more skin, more bone?) and not good for dogs with pancreatitis either, so we were going to get a case of turkey necks for him specifically.

    Thanks in advance...
    Heidi: Feeding raw to the dogs since 12/07...

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    You want to keep the fat content down. Backs ARE fatty. When you feed a premix diet, its impossible to control the fat amount. IMO feeding premix raw is nothing more than feeding raw kibble. My suggestion is to feed prey model raw so you have absolute control of the diet. It's easy to give pills in just a tiny splash of peanut butter or a little cheese.

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    He has pills and liquid that I need to give him...and since he's epileptic I like to really keep his diet as controlled as I can to keep the seizures at bay...in case the new food is a trigger. We've gone for 175 days with no seizures (which is great for him!) and are trying really hard to keep it that way...but then this happened and right now he's pretty sick.

    So by prey model, you mean no ground or I guess boneless type meals?

    I know you have websites RFD, so can you give me a few so I can see what you mean. I'm not against switching him...and then our lab...over to a different way to feed, I just need to understand. It took me a long time to wrap my brain around this whole raw feeding as it was...and now to change it up...lol

    Thanks for responding too, btw.
    Heidi: Feeding raw to the dogs since 12/07...

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    Senior Member Spicy1_VV's Avatar
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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Rabbit is low in fat and high in protein. That might be something that would work well for your dog. You can still feed chicken in comparison to other meats it is also low fat like chicken breast for instance, the backs are very fatty though and yes lots of bone. I always thought heart and even gizzard were muscle not organ.

    Feeding whole prey model you can give boneless meat or even some ground meat. It is just not premade. It is also like it sounds though the dogs food is modeled after the prey animals they eat. It is bone/meat + organ meat. No veggies or grains, ect. It is not ground or pattis like premade raw is but it doesn't mean you can't give some ground meat.

    I'd also cut the cottage cheese at least for the most part. It is considered rather salty for a dog to be eating everyday.

    There is a lot of info here
    http://www.rawmeatybones.com/

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Quote Originally Posted by Spicy1_VV View Post
    Rabbit is low in fat and high in protein.
    Would this be something that's good to switch him cold turkey (no pun lol) to? Or would it be too hard on his stomach right now. And actually i believe the store where we get our food has rabbit. She gets it from a local person I believe.

    My instinct is bland, bland, bland...but I don't want to do the whole boiled chicken/rice thing that is the first thing my mind thinks of when thinking of a bland dog diet.

    I'd also cut the cottage cheese at least for the most part. It is considered rather salty for a dog to be eating everyday.
    oooh i didn't even think about that. He needs a lower salt diet too, because the KBr he's on is salty!

    There is a lot of info here
    http://www.rawmeatybones.com/
    Thanks for the link too. I feel like I'm starting over.
    Heidi: Feeding raw to the dogs since 12/07...

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    I'd switch cold turkey if I were feeding what you are now and my dogs would probably be fine. Does he do bad with diet changes? Reading I'm getting he needs bland because of other health issues but not because of stomach upset?

    The rice and boiled chicken is usually considered bland but it is for temporary feeding like when they have a stomach illness such as when humans have the flu eat bland. This shouldn't be what a dog lives off of. I don't like feeding grains like rice myself, I don't think they are good for long term feeding. There also isn't any bone content in this diet which contains nutrition a dog needs especially calcium.

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    No, he does ok with diet changes...

    I just know that what we feed now is not a seizure trigger. On top of the pancreatitis he also has epilepsy, so he's on medication for that and it makes things easier on me if I know exactly what he's eating to try to pinpoint if a diet change was the trigger should he have a seizure.

    If we didn't have the epilepsy factor, I'd switch with no problems.

    I don't have to feed him per doctor's orders till the morning...not that he'd eat now anyways...so i am going to read and decide what we're going to do.

    Thanks for your responses!
    Heidi: Feeding raw to the dogs since 12/07...

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Here are some web pages. Remember for your special needs, remove the skin from the chicken. Skin is fatty.

    Get the book "Work Wonders" by Tom Lonsdale. You may download the book for $9.95 from http://www.ebookmall.com/ebooks-auth...ale-ebooks.htm or order hard copy either at http://www.dogwise.com or at http://www.amazon.com (cheaper).

    A few informative web sites are:
    http://www.skylarzack.com/rawfeeding.htm (My web page)
    http://rawfeddogs.net/ --- be sure and check the recipes page.
    http://www.rawlearning.com/rawfaq.html
    http://www.rawfed.com/myths/index.html
    http://www.rawmeatybones.com

    Join the yahoo rawfeeding group at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rawfeeding/ You will get more useful practical information here than all the books combined. It's a very active group with over 11,000 members who feed raw.

    All theee place are talking about healthy dogs. You can get a lot of info about pancreatic dogs at the rawfeeding yahoo site.

    EDITED TO ADD: Yes you can feed some boneless meals and some ground meals but a good part will be animal parts with both meat and bone. You will also feed some organs.
    Last edited by RawFedDogs; 10-20-2008 at 07:28 PM.

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Thanks again for the links and advice. It's hard to know what's right to do when you have different opinions coming at you from all sides.

    I'm not 100% sure what we're going to do about his food yet...but he's doing 100% better. He's almost back to his old self.
    Heidi: Feeding raw to the dogs since 12/07...

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Quote Originally Posted by heidiann View Post
    Thanks again for the links and advice. It's hard to know what's right to do when you have different opinions coming at you from all sides.
    Whenever in doubt about what to do with your dog, you can do what I do ... look to nature. Nature got it all right. If you want to know what to feed your dog, nature can tell you. In the wild and without human intervention, your dog would eat meat, bones, and organs from any animal he could catch and kill either individually or as part of a pack. He would not eat green beens, yellow squash, or okra. he would not eat cooked food or ground food or mashed food. He would eat the whole animal exclusive of stomach contents or intestinal contents. You can't go wrong feeding the food nature designed him to eat.

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Quote Originally Posted by RawFedDogs View Post
    Whenever in doubt about what to do with your dog, you can do what I do ... look to nature. Nature got it all right. If you want to know what to feed your dog, nature can tell you. In the wild and without human intervention, your dog would eat meat, bones, and organs from any animal he could catch and kill either individually or as part of a pack. He would not eat green beens, yellow squash, or okra. he would not eat cooked food or ground food or mashed food. He would eat the whole animal exclusive of stomach contents or intestinal contents. You can't go wrong feeding the food nature designed him to eat.
    Not to argue raw diet (I'm already a believer), but saying my dog wouldn't eat green beans is flat out false! I've seen fully formed green beans come out his other end that he's taken of his own choice from the garden :P

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Quote Originally Posted by trumpetjock View Post
    Not to argue raw diet (I'm already a believer), but saying my dog wouldn't eat green beans is flat out false! I've seen fully formed green beans come out his other end that he's taken of his own choice from the garden :P
    "In the wild without human intervention", there would be no green beans, yellow squash, or Okra. That was my point. People sometimes feed "domestic" veggies thinking their dogs would eat them in nature when in all reality there would be none in nature. The veggies they would have available in the wild would be things like grass, weeds, leaves, twigs and occasional berries during season.

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    Re: Topaz was dx with Pancreatitis...raw menu change?

    Quote Originally Posted by trumpetjock View Post
    I've seen fully formed green beans come out his other end that he's taken of his own choice from the garden :P
    If it's coming out the same as it went in, the dog probably isn't getting benefits from eating it. From what I understand that's the problem with feeding dogs vegetables.

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