[Vixen16]

So about 8am yesterday Morning I took Bonnie for a walk in the woods out back... well we had something like 6inches of snow on the ground. Going from my back door into the neighbors yard there were some unknown tracks. When we first got out there I just sorta made my way following the tracks and Bonnie sorta went where I went...
When we got to the shed I pointed at the Tracks and said "Whats that?" to Bonnie and she started to dig through the snow as if there was something there ((which she always does when I say that, snow or not)) and then she stopped, sniffed and started following the Tracks and if she was Trail/Scent Hunting.. and she followed the tracks perfectly up until she got about 20ft into the neighbors yard then I called her back into our yard ((she wasnt on a leash))... I was amazed at how well she did and I wasnt even expecting it or planned it!!!
So my question is... Does she have a Scent Breed in her that we dont know about? Umm I know she has Pointer in her but there characteristics dont Hunt like that... There Gun Dogs, the Pointer "Points" to the direction or the Birds or the Hunter shoots the Bird and the Pointer retrieves it .. Not sticks its nose to the ground and Sniffs ((like a Bassett Hound, Blood Hound, ect.)). She does Point occasionally but she didnt at all Yesterday Morning... she stuck her nose to the ground and stiffed. She also has Border Collie in her but they dont hunt at all and she has Pitt in her but ive never heard of them doing that either.
Anyone have any thoughts on this??
((I wish id thought about my camera before I left the house))

Heres a pic of her so you can look and maybe someone will spot a hint of somethin else in there... Or you know what we'll just got with "What breed do you think she is??"...



[[Im almost tempted to have the DNA Test done the next Vet visit she has... Just to see what shes mixed with]]

[RonE]

I'm sorry, Vixen16. I would love to read your post and respond to it, but your oversize bold type is making me blind.

Please use alternate types for emphasis only. I've asked you before - I thought politely. Next I'll have to start deleting posts.

[Vixen16]

Oh sorry... all fixed. It wont happen again.

[RonE]

Thanks. Much better.

I didn't know this until I got a lab, but labs have amazing noses. Right up there with the hounds. I guess that's why they excel at search and rescue, bomb and drug detection, etc. Maybe your dog has some lab. (Almost all mixes have some lab, it seems.)

My previous lab and I were walking when he stopped, stuck his head into about a foot of snow, and came out with a crust of bread he found buried there.

I looked at him in amazement and said, "How did you know that was in there?"

Nearly all dogs have a great sense of smell, even if it's not what they were bred for.

[Spicy1_VV]

Originally Posted by Vixen16

So about 8am yesterday Morning I took Bonnie for a walk in the woods out back... well we had something like 6inches of snow on the ground. Going from my back door into the neighbors yard there were some unknown tracks. When we first got out there I just sorta made my way following the tracks and Bonnie sorta went where I went...
When we got to the shed I pointed at the Tracks and said "Whats that?" to Bonnie and she started to dig through the snow as if there was something there ((which she always does when I say that, snow or not)) and then she stopped, sniffed and started following the Tracks and if she was Trail/Scent Hunting.. and she followed the tracks perfectly up until she got about 20ft into the neighbors yard then I called her back into our yard ((she wasnt on a leash))... I was amazed at how well she did and I wasnt even expecting it or planned it!!!
So my question is... Does she have a Scent Breed in her that we dont know about? Umm I know she has Pointer in her but there characteristics dont Hunt like that... There Gun Dogs, the Pointer "Points" to the direction or the Birds or the Hunter shoots the Bird and the Pointer retrieves it .. Not sticks its nose to the ground and Sniffs ((like a Bassett Hound, Blood Hound, ect.)). She does Point occasionally but she didnt at all Yesterday Morning... she stuck her nose to the ground and stiffed. She also has Border Collie in her but they dont hunt at all and she has Pitt in her but ive never heard of them doing that either.
Anyone have any thoughts on this??
((I wish id thought about my camera before I left the house))

Heres a pic of her so you can look and maybe someone will spot a hint of somethin else in there... Or you know what we'll just got with "What breed do you think she is??"...

I would say it doesn't mean she has any type of hound breed in her at all. All dogs have good noses, some breeds are selectively developed sure, but many breeds can smell good.

I "trained" my female to search and she does great. She is registered, almost a conformation CH, and came from breeder/breeding I know, she isn't any sort of hound mixed in. Basically she has the natural instinct to do this and I just gave her some commands along with it. Like you she surprising caught on very quick and is now consistent. She can find any object I hide anywhere through sent. If there is any scent trail that I can find I can also tell her to follow that. When she finds the point of original she alerts be by sitting, barking or pawing at the location. Before I was suggested to take her to a facility that trains cadaver dogs before I moved. It was still a bit of a drive from where I lived (I think like 3hrs) so I never did it, but someone else did with their Pit that lived in that town.
She points as well and again this is a natural dog thing. Pointers/Setters have been specifically bred for this but its natural like anything else bred in a dog. People isolate the traits they want in a purebred dog so that they are magnified. It doesn't mean all other breeds have lost those instincts. I had a picture of her pointing that I posted on a forum I remember people had a few negative comments about my dogs (thats when I was a new member) and one was "look at that dog, her paw is hurt too!" Or something stupid like that. Wolves also point as I've seen on TV.

My other female is excellent to find vermin via scent. She won't quit until she finds it or I tell her otherwise. She is also very fast and agile so she makes an excellent dog for this.

My other female (RIP) was one of the best mouser and small vermin dogs around. If you told her to get it she would get all excited and start looking around. If there wasn't anything immediately visible she would start scenting following smells of where the animal had been. Sometimes she'd find nothing because she either couldn't find a trail or the animal was moved on. Other times she'd make a find.

This is just like non herding dogs herding. Its a canine instinct that is controlled and lessoned. Herding breeds have it again selectively bred as a strong trait but non herding breeds can still herd ok (depending on the dog). The above female also learned to herd.

Actually many terriers can use their nose to find small vermin and game. Really most dogs can use a combination of scent/sight to find prey or other animals. When there has been a strange dog in my home and I let the dogs down from upstairs after that dog is gone they immediately stop and sniff everywhere that dog has been. One was even barking at the bathroom door where my friends dog had been crated over night even though he was now gone. She could smell the intruders scent.

Pit Bulls are also used as detection dogs. Explosive and narcotics. http://www.lawdogsusa.org/home.html

While many Shepherds have been used as patrol dogs there are also many I've seen as detection dogs too. German, Belgian and Dutchies too. SCH (or VPG) requires tracking (along with obedience/protection) and it used to asses a German Shepherds quality for breeding. In Germany it is required before breeding, here its optional like anything else but many breeders SCH train/title their dogs. Many other breeds also compete in SCH, including Pit Bulls, Rottweilers, Dobermans and many others.

I would imagine a Border Collie would have a great sense of smell too.

[Vixen16]

Hmmm... im sure she can smell awesomely, because we went back out to the woods today and followed what looked like bunny tracks, she didnt do what she did yesterday though. When we came up to a stump or a hole where the Bunny had dug, she'd sniff it and if she caught a scent she'd dig and if she didnt she'd just look at me and walk away... we eventually found a Northern Short Tailed Shrews tracts...which the scent of a NST Shrew is familiar to Bonnie because we use to own one not to long ago... and I followed the tracks up until we hit a log and thats when she caught the scent and dug the log up till she found its hoarding place... pretty cool actually.

Idk what else to say honestly... Spicy, you actually make a lot of sense.

What breeds does she look like?? I know what breeds she is but does anyone see anything other than Border Collie, Pitt, Pointer?? [[its more of an experimental thing]]

[jcd]

i definatly see pitt in her. real pretty. ears and head are pitt. border collie also . not sure what else.

how old?

[Shaina]

Originally Posted by RonE

I didn't know this until I got a lab, but labs have amazing noses. Right up there with the hounds. I guess that's why they excel at search and rescue, bomb and drug detection, etc. Maybe your dog has some lab. (Almost all mixes have some lab, it seems.)

My previous lab and I were walking when he stopped, stuck his head into about a foot of snow, and came out with a crust of bread he found buried there.

I looked at him in amazement and said, "How did you know that was in there?"

Nearly all dogs have a great sense of smell, even if it's not what they were bred for.

Agreed on the lab scent thing -- the last time I visited my parents, I took my Kim on a hike through some of the fields and woods around my parents house in about 4 inches of snow. Two days later after it had all melted, I took my parents' lab on a walk, starting at the same point. He started tracking the way Kim and I had gone two days before, so I let him at it and just trailed behind--we ended up retracing the whole route lol.

[Vixen16]

We dont know exactly how old but were guessing about 10-12 yrs... shes got Cataracts and possible Arthritis so shes pretty old.

[Spicy1_VV]

Originally Posted by Vixen16

Hmmm... im sure she can smell awesomely, because we went back out to the woods today and followed what looked like bunny tracks, she didnt do what she did yesterday though. When we came up to a stump or a hole where the Bunny had dug, she'd sniff it and if she caught a scent she'd dig and if she didnt she'd just look at me and walk away... we eventually found a Northern Short Tailed Shrews tracts...which the scent of a NST Shrew is familiar to Bonnie because we use to own one not to long ago... and I followed the tracks up until we hit a log and thats when she caught the scent and dug the log up till she found its hoarding place... pretty cool actually.

Idk what else to say honestly... Spicy, you actually make a lot of sense.

What breeds does she look like?? I know what breeds she is but does anyone see anything other than Border Collie, Pitt, Pointer?? [[its more of an experimental thing]]

So did she find anything? Its always lovely when they dig something up and bring it to you. Yuck.

Well I think she certainly looks like a Border Collie mix. I can see that as possible with the color/coat and I'm not sure what else just the "look" of her like in her face. As far as Pit I'm uncertain. If she is also known to be Pit then I wouldn't have much trouble believing it even though she doesn't have Pit features. Also it is Pit not Pitt. I'm not real sure on pointer. Someone could say she has the head/muzzle of some pointers but the way she looks is also easily attributed to her being Pit/BorderCollie and whatever else? Some mixed breeds can turn out looking similar to a totally different breed when the features get mixed.

So do you know what breeds she really is? As you said you know what breed but also mentioned doing the DNA test.

Her looks could put her passing for mixes of other breeds but there is a whole bunch of them.

Here is a Boxer/Pointer mix

[Vixen16]

Nah, she didn't find anything but some old Nuts... and she doesn't really bring things back to me, she makes me get my "Paws" dirty too.

I don't see how you don't see Pit...?
Any stranger who meets her, there first question is "Is she a Pit Bull?"
Plus ive seen Pit in her since the day we got her ((she was much younger then, though)), and her pups came out clearly looking like Border Collie/Pit Bull.

Here iv looked up some pics of all the breeds mixed 2 by 2 ((i couldn't find a Border Collie Pit Pointer mix pics though)) these are the best pics i could find...

Heres a 4yr old Pit Bull/Pointer...


Heres a Border Collie/Pointer....


Heres a 2yr old Border Collie/Pit Bull...


And heres one of Bonnies pups at the age of 3yrs, The pups possible father was a small terrier thing...


Anybody can see Border Collie and Pit in her, The Pointer is a lil harder to see but people have seen it. How do you not see Pit though??

[Spicy1_VV]

I don't think she has hound anyway, but guess you never know. Pit/Border Collie seems to sum her up.

I don't know what you want me to say. There are many breeds that look like Pits so how can I know that she is or isn't a Pit? If I saw her pup I could easily think it is Catahoula cross.

Pits don't have fluffy hair like that, especially where it poofs out around her. If they ask if she is a Pit then they are out of their mind. She looks like she has a Pit face/expression which is about all the Pit I see in her. Her hair gives her away as an obvious mix, probably is Border Collie or something similar. Many people don't even know what Pits look like. I've had people ask me if my Boxer was a Pit, my friends Boerboel was called a Pit and so was my other friends Cane Corso. Both my own have both been called Pits, my Corso at least a dozen times people have ask if she is on or commented on her being a pretty one. On the other hand I've had people mistake my Pits for American Bulldog, Shar Pei, Boxer, Lab and whatever else.

This Catahoula has a very similar head to that pup.


These are a few others






If you had other pics like from the side/profile shots that would help a lot. Because from the front just her head/face is Pit looking, not much else. I have seen this same head/facial expression in most cur breeds which doesn't mean she isn't a Pit mix either. So it all depends on ones opinion. The reason Catahoulas were used to get the merle color in APBTs is because they can look so similar. Then again how would I know what a Pit looks like anyway.

[Vixen16]

Well I didnt mean to make it sound like you didnt know what a Pit looked like... I just couldnt figure out how you didnt think she had Pit Bull in her. I do have pics of her from a side view..

These 2 pics are the best pics I could find ((all the good ones are on my moms comp))...




Yea her hair is a lil fluffier than Pitt Bulls but im thinkin thats the Border Collie.
I know what Pit Bulls look like cuz [of the pure breeds] we Fostered a Red Nose Red Brindle Pit Bull for a while ((i dont have any pics of her though)) and I lived with a friend who bred Blue Nose Blue Brindle Pit Bulls...
This is Dozer my Friends [use to be] Stud ((hes standing in a Whelping Box))....


As for Bonnies Puppy.. I lived in the neighborhood where she got preggers for 2 yrs, I knew everyone but there was never a Catahoula in the neighborhood. And the only Brindle Dog in the neighborhood was a small Terrier thing ((im not sure exactly what)). [[ 2 of 7 of Bonnies pups came out Brindle, the rest were Black and White (marked) like her... 6 came out with short hair and one came out Fluffy like a Border Collie.]]

[RonE]

I don't care what she is, that is an immensely handsome and noble-looking dog.

[ChrissyBz]

I don't care what she is, that is an immensely handsome and noble-looking dog.

RonE: well said, and I completely agree and now that I can read the OP I'll post.

Thank you Vixen for changing your font. You have a beautiful dog.

[Spicy1_VV]

Originally Posted by Vixen16

Well I didnt mean to make it sound like you didnt know what a Pit looked like... I just couldnt figure out how you didnt think she had Pit Bull in her. I do have pics of her from a side view..

These 2 pics are the best pics I could find ((all the good ones are on my moms comp))...

Yea her hair is a lil fluffier than Pitt Bulls but im thinkin thats the Border Collie.
I know what Pit Bulls look like cuz [of the pure breeds] we Fostered a Red Nose Red Brindle Pit Bull for a while ((i dont have any pics of her though)) and I lived with a friend who bred Blue Nose Blue Brindle Pit Bulls...
This is Dozer my Friends [use to be] Stud ((hes standing in a Whelping Box))....

As for Bonnies Puppy.. I lived in the neighborhood where she got preggers for 2 yrs, I knew everyone but there was never a Catahoula in the neighborhood. And the only Brindle Dog in the neighborhood was a small Terrier thing ((im not sure exactly what)). [[ 2 of 7 of Bonnies pups came out Brindle, the rest were Black and White (marked) like her... 6 came out with short hair and one came out Fluffy like a Border Collie.]]

I don't know what she is either way. If one thinks they see Pit Bull in her then they must also consent that they see the possibility of other breeds since there are several other breeds which look similar or at times almost identical to APBTs. That is what I mean, not that she isn't part Pit Bull.

Just comparing these 2 pics I was noticing some similarity.





Your friends Pit Bull is very handsome.

I didn't mean that the pups sire was a Catahoula, sorry for the confusion. I was thinking Bonnie could be mixed with Catahoula or whatever else instead of Pit Bull. I think you probably have a good guess on Pit/Border Collie though. I think I wasn't clear in saying there are other possibilities. Instead it came out wrong that I was saying she couldn't be mixed with Pit Bull but I wasn't trying to say that.

No matter what she has an intelligent look about her. Something like wisdom in her face.

I was just having fun with one of my Pits. Having them find a mouse I would hide. She really loves this hide and seek business.

Oh yeah also when I said many people don't know what Pits look like I didn't mean you either. I was saying like people that ask you or average joe public. I can see that she looks like a Pit mix, but not a purebred.

[Vixen16]

That makes more since... I was looking at the shape of Bonnies head and I saw Catahoula ((judging from the first Catahoula pic of course))... I think. Now I really wanna get the Test done just to see what she is! lol I guess in some ways we'll never know.
Ive never seen a Catahoula in person or action so idk what to look for as far as Characteristics.

Bonnie is very intelligent, we also Play the hide and Seek game and she loves it. She knows the difference between Left and Right, she knows if I put my hand in front of her that means to Sit and Stay... she just knows so much, its amazing.
We've never had a dog like Bonnie!!... but I guess there all One of a Kind!

Dozer is the most Handsome Pit ive ever seen... And the biggest Baby!! He came out with some pretty Pups too.

Oh and BTW.. theres this big tree that had falling over on the edge of the woods in my backyard, and in the tree theres this lil ((natural)) hole and Bonnie wont leave it alone! she sticks her nose in it ((which probably isnt a good idea)) and just sits there.. then she'll look at me, look back at it and she'll tilt her head at if somethings ganna crawl out... Its so funny. The next time we go out there im ganna bring my camera so I can get pics.