[Mom2Sadie]

as the "good" stuff. I've been reading about people who have used Puppy Chow and Dog Chow and done great on it. NO allergies, poop problems, etc.
Could it be that the premium foods are causing more problems? I'd LOVE to hear from people who used to feed cheap stuff and their dog did BAD on it and now they feed GOOD stuff and their dogs does great on it. Please??
I'm ready to throw away the raw, Wellness, Innova, etc. and go get a big bag of Dog Chow!

[RawFedDogs]

Originally Posted by Mom2Sadie

I'm ready to throw away the raw, Wellness, Innova, etc. and go get a big bag of Dog Chow!

That would be analogous to feeding your human children nothing but pizza and hamburgers. The cheap foods are cheap for a reason. Look at the ingredients. They have almost no meat in them and the meat they have is less than nutritious. Some of the ingredients in the cheap dog food are sawdust, peanut hulls, road kill animals, 4D livestock (dead, disabled,dying, diseased), BHA (thought to cause cancer in humans ... it's illegal to use in food for human consumption), propyl gallate (a chemical very similar to antifreeze), dried beet pulp, Ethoxyquin (another prervative thought to cause cancer in humans). All of these ingredients are in the cheap foods because they are cheap.

Stop and think about it. Nutrition cost money. These companies have to buy the ingredients, grind, mix, extrude, package, pay sales people and marketing expenses, advertising expenses, allow for margins for wholesalers and brokers, pay shipping, sell to grocery stores who will add to the profit. The cost of the original ingredients can't be more than pennies per pound.

What nutritious food can you buy for pennies per pound?

I don't need to read about experiences to know I wouldn't allow that garbage in my house. Heck I don't even have premium kibble in my house.

[jesirose]

Every dog is different. What problem is your dog having on the "good" foods?

[MegaMuttMom]

There are hundreds of threads about this topic. Do a forum search.

[Mom2Sadie]

Originally Posted by jesirose

Every dog is different. What problem is your dog having on the "good" foods?

Mostly loose stools. No, she doesn't have parasites. Also, she gets bored with food very quickly and turns her nose up at all of it, including raw!

Originally Posted by MegaMuttMom

There are hundreds of threads about this topic. Do a forum search.

Thanks.
I've read them. I KNOW that quality ingredients are supposed to be better but it seems to me that people who feed cheap food don't have the problems that we, who are trying to be healthy do. I just wanted to hear some first hand experiences.

[sheltiemom]

I'll comment on this, it isn't exactly what you asked for, but I'm one of the people who feeds a "crap" food, Purina One. I've tried many others and my dogs have had digestive issues (diarrhea, gas) or else I had a hard time keeping weight on two of them. We've been to the vet numerous times and treated for Giardia twice (even though they tested negative for it), the first time there was no change in the digestive issues, the second was just a couple weeks ago, so I don't know yet. I don't love the ingredients in the One, although imo there are many that are much worse, but at this point I'm afraid to change anything because my shelties haven't had diarrhea in several months (my bc has though which is why everyone was treated for Giardia). I don't know if it's the food, if it really was Giardia and it has cleared up, or if they've just grown out of their issues.

On a different note, my previous dog was fed kibbles and bits most of his life with no problems, but when he got to be about 9 or 10, issues with oily coat started showing up, dandruff, and finally he got a bacterial skin infection followed by an ear infection, so it could be bad food catching up to him, or could be just issues that an older dog would have anyway, who knows.

[RawFedDogs]

Originally Posted by Mom2Sadie

Mostly loose stools. No, she doesn't have parasites. Also, she gets bored with food very quickly and turns her nose up at all of it, including raw!

It's because you have created a picky eater. The dog knows if she holds out, you may come up with something better. She has you wrapped around her little paw.

Thanks.
I've read them. I KNOW that quality ingredients are supposed to be better but it seems to me that people who feed cheap food don't have the problems that we, who are trying to be healthy do. I just wanted to hear some first hand experiences.

In general, people who feed crap dog food don't care enough about their dogs to be concerned about loose stools, itching, etc.

[zimandtakandgrrandmimi]

I fed Alpo for a bit when I first got my girl. Skin infections, allergies, extreme non interest in food(sometimes as long as two weeks she would go without anything more than a bite or two! no matter what I did to make it tastier) tooth decay out the wazoo even with regular professional tooth cleaning. Vet visits ONCE A MONTH minimum for an ever increasing array of issues. Extremely lethargic and tempermental.

On raw....Perfect teeth, perfect breath, perfect skin, perfect coat, enthusiastic about dinnertime, Vet visits cut down drastically, energy great, temperment mellowed drastically(perhaps something to do with more satisfying food...I dunno...but there was a marked change immediately after the switch and with her being dog aggressive that was a serious blessing)

different dogs have different needs though.....use what keeps your dogs healthy and happy....

[Mom2Sadie]

Originally Posted by RawFedDogs

It's because you have created a picky eater. The dog knows if she holds out, you may come up with something better. She has you wrapped around her little paw.

You are SO right! So, she won't starve herself if I don't give in, right?



In general, people who feed crap dog food don't care enough about their dogs to be concerned about loose stools, itching, etc.

Something else I never thought about!

[briteday]

One dog was on Nutro when we got her, another on Dog Chow from the shelter, the third one was on premium kibble when we got her.

The Nutro dog had all types of food sensitivities that showed up around a year of age and she was failing to thrive.

The Dog Chow dog would walk past her food bowl for days without eating, untilwe switched her food.

The third dog was on good food but her teeth were horrendous.

All three dogs now eat a raw diet and their problems have disappeared. We use Solid Gold and Taste of the Wild if we cannot feed raw for some reason.

Personally, the only downfall I see with grocery store brands is that they are loaded with fillers (ingredients that the dog gets little nutritional value from) so you end up feeding more. And I wonder about companies who would sell a food loaded with cheap fillers (costing you more in the long run as you are feeding more of it) how much quality control they maintain over their resources. The last straw for us was the dog food recalls. I realized that most larger companies cannot, or do not, maintain control over their central resources. And by feeding raw I can have control over that. And I am not feeding all of the cheap filler material, mostly carbs, that made my dogs fat with bad teeth.

[MegaMuttMom]

OK, I have more time now so I will answer.

My dog was on Iams first and then Science Diet. He bit at himself constantly, as if he had fleas. When Petco didn't have his science diet variety in stock, I went to a boutique store looking for it.

The boutique store didn't sell Science Diet but recommended a Solid Gold formula they thought sounded good for my dog. He has eaten it ever since. He no longer bites at himself and his energy and coat are better.

I believe it was the corn in the Iams and Science Diet that were making him itch.

My cat had very bad teeth so we fed her Friskies Dental Diet in an attempt to help her with her teeth. After I found the new food for my dog, I asked for recommendations on cat food at the boutique pet store. She now eats Innova EVO. She loves this food. She has always been underweight, now she has gained some weight. Her coat is healthier and her overall "spunk" is improved. Her teeth still aren't great but, they are not getting any worse. So, I won't be feeding her Purina again.

[UrbanBeagles]

In general, people who feed crap dog food don't care enough about their dogs to be concerned about loose stools, itching, etc.

You really enjoy stretching the limits of condesention, don't you?

Still waiting to see recent pics of your raw eating dogs. I'll show you mine if you show me yours

My horribly uncared for Beagles on crap food (who have firm poos, who do not itch or scratch) Taken in June '08, 6+ months on Dog Chow, and on Purina ONE L&R before that:




Somebody, PLEASE report me to the ASPCA ...

[jesirose]

A lot of people say when you switch foods often, it can result in loose stools. You mentioned several brands as well as raw so I would suspect that could be part of the problem. How long have you tried each of these? When you fed raw what were you feeding? We tried Blue Buffallo food which many people say is great, but Sadie got loose stools on it, so we then tried California Naturals, which stopped that problem. We have actually tried many foods I guess! After that Canidae, and now raw.

She may also just not be hungry enough to eat all of the food you provide, so it seems like she's turning her nose up to it. And if you do give in to it when you think she wants something else, it reinforces that, just like ANY other behavior you reinforce. It's basically begging, but at her dinner table instead of yours.

I couldn't get my cats to eat anything but Friskies until I got Canidae for the dog, and they started stealing it. I got them Felidae and they did great, the Siamese mix got more energy and they both had less poop. I'm working on switching them to raw right now. But I'm sure they could have done fine on the Friskies. But IMO it wouldn't be what's BEST for them. Yes, they could do fine and never get sick, never have skin or coat problems - same with my Sadie eating whatever dog food one might consider crap. I could also get by on crap food myself - heck I eat plenty of Kraft Mac & Cheese and frozen dinners - but I know I truly feel better and healthier when I eat lean protien and lots of veggies.

The difference is my pets don't get to choose - so I have to make the choice for them what I think is best. If I want to throw away my better health it's my choice, but I think feeding them raw or at least the best dry food I could find - it's better in the long run.

[Criosphynx]

Originally Posted by UrbanBeagles

You really enjoy stretching the limits of condesention, don't you?

Still waiting to see recent pics of your raw eating dogs. I'll show you mine if you show me yours

My horribly uncared for Beagles on crap food (who have firm poos, who do not itch or scratch) Taken in June '08, 6+ months on Dog Chow, and on Purina ONE L&R before that:




Somebody, PLEASE report me to the ASPCA ...

Im still waiting as well ...lol


your dog looks gorgeous...i'll have to report you.

[jbray01]

i'm having such a struggle over food myself. i have been feeding rosie iams and she has been doing really well on it. i have been looking around at some different foods lately because i have heard nothing good about iams. i actually posted a topic on it not too long ago...for now i'm keeping her on iams at least until i find something i really like. shes healthy, big, energetic, she has a nice shiny coat, she has nice big clean teeth, she smells like roses (not really haha but pretty close) she does not have bad doggie breath, and i haven't had any health issues yet...except one.

she is extremely prone to ear infections. and i know they are more common in floppy earred dogs, but she gets them like once a 1-2 months( and we do clean her ears regularly)

do you think that could be something that could be remedied by a better food?

[amynrichie]

Originally Posted by Mom2Sadie

as the "good" stuff. I've been reading about people who have used Puppy Chow and Dog Chow and done great on it. NO allergies, poop problems, etc.
Could it be that the premium foods are causing more problems? I'd LOVE to hear from people who used to feed cheap stuff and their dog did BAD on it and now they feed GOOD stuff and their dogs does great on it. Please??
I'm ready to throw away the raw, Wellness, Innova, etc. and go get a big bag of Dog Chow!

I had a lab/chow mix who ate nothing but ol roy and purina for about 10 years. She seemed *fine* until I really started to pay attention to how much she was scratching. It progressed until she would be literally digging at her face and rubbing her head all over the carpet every time she ate. Her hair was falling out in patches and her ears were smelly all the time. She too would get disinterested in food, so I would mix a can of ol roy with the dry so she would eat it. After a few months I googled "dog scratching" and found a wealth of info on dog food. I switched to innova with no result, (too many indredients for her allergies.) I put her on California Natural lamb and rice with almost immediate results. Her rough patchy coat filled in and gained some shine. She quit limping and *moping* around and actually started prancing again! I kept her on cal nat until she died 3 years later.
I have a lot of guilt over how I let her decline so much and truly believe that her life would not have been limited to 13 years, and we could have avoided a lot of misery if I had known more about quality dog food earlier.
Others here do "just fine" on any ol food, but I refuse to feed anything with corn in it ever again. Chicken Soup is my first choice as it is least expensive here. I also feed solid gold or innova. I do not free feed, so these foods are really not that expensive when a large bag lasts 6-7 weeks for my two small dogs.
Just my 2 cents, HTH.

[Inga]

Mom2sadie just a thought. I wonder if the loose stools might be caused by "over feeding?" Often the "good foods" need less to maintain the dogs weight and often people over feed the dog. This will cause loose stools. Maybe try cutting back just a bit for a few days and see if that helps. It might also explain the disinterest in the food as your dog is simply NOT hungry. Good luck with this.
As far as crap foods being as good for your dog? I do not believe this. I work in rescue and see hundreds of dogs each year that are fed that "crap food" I think I can say with some experience, They do NOT look good in comparison. I am not judging anyone who feeds that though. If that is what you chose for your dog, so be it. I prefer to feed a premium food to my dogs. They look good and seem to feel good on it. Yes, they do get gas sometimes, this is helped by adding a spoonful of plain, low-fat yogurt to each meal.

[RonE]

The family beagle we had while I was growing up ate Gravey Train and Gainsburgers. He lived to be 14 and was a healthy guy all his life.

Who's to say he wouldn't have lived another good year or three if he'd been fed a quality food?

You hear about people who smoke and drink and eat whatever they feel like for 90 years, but do you really want to imagine that's the norm?

[flipgirl]

Originally Posted by Mom2Sadie

as the "good" stuff. I've been reading about people who have used Puppy Chow and Dog Chow and done great on it. NO allergies, poop problems, etc.
Could it be that the premium foods are causing more problems? I'd LOVE to hear from people who used to feed cheap stuff and their dog did BAD on it and now they feed GOOD stuff and their dogs does great on it. Please??
I'm ready to throw away the raw, Wellness, Innova, etc. and go get a big bag of Dog Chow!

Finding a good food for your dog is trial and error. My friend has a dog who used to eat Beneful, which to me, is one of the worst foods on the market. I have never read a thread on this forum saying that someone's dog was doing well on this food! However, when my friend's dog, which is a Wheaton x poodle mix, was on Beneful, his coat was greasy, dull and matted. He had no energy and he smelled bad. Then he changed to Eagle Pack Holistic Selects Anchovy and Salmon and his coat is much better and he doesn't smell and his stools are better. He has since changed to Wellness Core but is doing well on it.

But, as many have said before, every dog is different. My dog was on Eagle Pack's Holistic Selects Chicken and Rice but she got sick of it so I changed her to Merrick Puppy Plate. She became very hyper and her tear stains worsened. So I changed her to Innova. She did well on Innova but I decided to change her to a homecooked diet. (Partly homemade - I mix meat, eggs, oil, veggies and fruit with a pre-mix) Her tear stains are pretty much gone and her coat is soft as cotton and shiny. She is calm and has tons of vitality.

But it doesn't mean your dog will do well on premium food. These foods may simply contain ingredients that your dog cannot tolerate. Why don't you try something like Chicken Soup for the Soul? I've read many posts say it's a good food and it's reasonably priced? Or you can try Purina One or Purina Pro Plan? I've read a lot of posts on this forum from people who show their dogs and they're on PUrina Pro Plan.

[Shaina]

This goes in the opposite direction but...

Kim started on Puppy Chow. It's what she was on before coming to me, and I didn't want to switch her food as she was adjusting to her new life...a few weeks later she was still a mess: itchy, runny stool, the works.

Switched to Iams because, I'll be honest, at the time I thought it was the greatest food out there. No noticeable improvement...maybe a little less runny, though we fed that for about two months.

Switch to Nature's Recipe as it didn't have corn, beef or wheat, which I had by then learned are often allergens. The stools again improved, and the itching lessens, but she was still scratching and biting at herself more than I thought was normal.

Joined DF...started on Canidae...marked improvement in coat quality and in her energy level, and the scratchiness tapered off further. After a few months switched again to Eagle Pack Holistic (fish)...further improvement though we're talking nominal at this point. She would still get runny stool every so often, for no particular reason.

In June of this year, switched to EVO - she did fantastic except that the calorie count was waaaay to high for her, since she was still under 18 months and unable to do really rigorous activity, so she put on some unnecessary weight since feeding her any less than I did created problems likely associated with not having enough bulk moving through her system.

I suspect that she would do quite well on any other grainless kibble, but with a lower kcal/cup, so that she could have more bulk in her system.

We're doing raw now and so far so good, but it's only been about two months so far.

Webster has a gut of iron and has had no problems with regular Innova, Canidae, Eagle Pack, EVO, or raw though he too gained an extra pound or two on EVO.