[Chelsea and Oskar]

Oskar (5 months) is very sweet and happy most of the time. However sometimes if he gets in trouble or we have something he wants and we ignore him he will bark at us, especially my boyfriend.
I really don’t think I’m being too rough with him. If he does something like herd, bite too much, or try to dominate me, I’ll say “NO!” and sometimes grab his collar and give him a little shake (advised to me), or I’ll take him by the collar and walk him to the kitchen for a time out. He tried nipping at me once and whining, but I’m seriously being very gentle about it, and it really surprised me he’d act like that.
With my boyfriend, Oskar gets very “angry” at. If my boyfriend tells him “NO” or approaches him he hides under me and barks in defense (although its not an aggressive bark) and then he’ll make all these (really funny) noises, comparable to a child huffing and whining. If he keeps telling Oskar “NO! Don’t bark at me, no barking” he’ll sometimes growl. It usually ends up with my boyfriend backing down, or me telling Oskar to “stop, its okay”. This is why I think its not, because I think hes doing it to get his way. Maybe he doesn’t like my boyfriend…

Anytime after we are “mad” at him and he cools down, he have “hugs and kisses” time, so he knows we forgive him, and then put him in his crate if he is being too much of a handful, like a cool down nap with out it being punishment.

Am I being too easy? Are these signs of aggression?
Advice would be great. Also if you have a similar breed, maybe you can tell me about your dog’s temperament. (Oskar is german Shepard/boarder collie/spitz mix).

[RBark]

It sounds like a confused puppy to me. I would recommend that you not do the collar shake and pick up the book "The Other End of the Leash". It will tell you far more than any of us can in a single thread.

EDIT: And no, there's no aggression at all. I can't quite word it right here without sounding somehow offensive- but to put simply, you invaded his space and he defended it from the way you describe it. I'm dumbing it down and it's not accurate at all, I'm sure someone else can put into words what I'm thinking better.

To go even further into detail, when you are talking sentences to him while your body language is showing anger, it's only riling him up even more and confusing him even more. He doesn't know what you are trying to tell him. He doesn't know what "No barking" means. To put simply he was set up to fail.

The book will teach you far more about what your dog is trying to tell you and what your body, words, tone, facial expression is telling him. That's what he's listening to, not your words.

[Chelsea and Oskar]

Yeah, I'll look into getting that book.
I'm starting to get way confused on if I'm being mean or too gentle with my dog. So many people, here, vets, dog owners, family, tell me different things that are the "right" thing to do.
Of course I'd never hit or yell at my dog, but just saying "whatever, its my fault" seems to be him getting to be the dominate one.
Dominance has always been a bit of a struggle with me and my dog, I'm soft spoken and shy (in person) and I think he tries to take advantage of that and test his limits with me. He never does that with my boyfriend...

Maybe I should also speak to a dog trainer, or take some basic classes.

*EDIT* By the way, the collar shake was suggested by a few people here who own other herding dogs who were having similar issues with herding and domiance. It actually stopped the herding habits.

[Curbside Prophet]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

I really don’t think I’m being too rough with him. If he does something like herd, bite too much, or try to dominate me, I’ll say “NO!” and sometimes grab his collar and give him a little shake (advised to me), or I’ll take him by the collar and walk him to the kitchen for a time out.

I don't know who advised this to you, but I have a few questions for them. Let's look at this from the training perspective...

So you are ignoring your dog (the antecedent), your dog herds and bites you (the behavior), so you grab his collar and give him attention (the consequence). Can you see how you may be reinforcing the behavior? The dog wants attention and he's learned that by herding you he gets attention.

The scenario is the same when your bf does it too.

Anytime after we are “mad” at him and he cools down, he have “hugs and kisses” time, so he knows we forgive him, and then put him in his crate if he is being too much of a handful, like a cool down nap with out it being punishment.

The dog doesn't know you forgave him. Dogs do not have moral values like humans do. All he knows is that the two of you are inconsistent with your rewards and punishments, which can in itself be the likely cause of the behavior.

Am I being too easy? Are these signs of aggression?

These are signs of being a confused puppy.

Advice would be great.

Get your dog to an obedience class.
Practice NILIF religiously.
Use your crate to manage him more frequently.
Read the Bite Stops Here article.

[TooneyDogs]

I sincerely hope you have puppy classes scheduled. It sounds like you are not reading or understanding your puppys body language or how to resolve several different issues in a nonthreatening way. Your boyfriend is scaring the hell out the puppy and the warning barks are turning in growls because the puppy is scared to death. The next step for the puppy would be biting out of self defense.
Fear looks totally different than aggression...the facial expressions and body postures are like day and night. These are things that a good puppy socialization class can teach as well as how to handle many situations in a non-confrontational manner.

[Willowy]

"Dominance", as the term is generally used, is overrated. Most dogs do not want to be the Alpha, and will not try to be the Alpha. However, somebody needs to be in charge, and if you aren't giving the impression that you are in charge, the dog may feel the need to step up. There is no reason to use force. I'm not a trainer, and I probably am not saying this correctly. But, basically, there is no reason your dog should be taking advantage of you even if you are soft-spoken and small. The best-trained dog I ever knew was a huge GSD whose owner was very small, feminine, and soft. But they communicated beautifully, and he knew exactly what she wanted him to do, and did it. It's all about communication.

[Chelsea and Oskar]

Curbside Prophet :
The herding isn't when I ignore him, it's when I'm walking down the hall, or he gets too excited from playing. Ignoring his herding just made it worse.

The forgiving thing, is like 10 mins later, not directly after. Still confusing?
I read about how you don't want your dog to think you are still mad at him and so on.

Classes will be something I'll look into, but something I'd have to wait to do until May when my finals are over. I'm sure I can find a good place by then. I'll work with him until then...

--

TooneyDogs: Scared maybe, but we seriously are just talking a little louder, nothing we do is rough or hard.

[Curbside Prophet]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

The herding isn't when I ignore him, it's when I'm walking down the hall, or he gets too excited from playing. Ignoring his herding just made it worse.

Even better, you know exactly when the behavior occurs, and you've noticed that ignoring him doesn't work. So to change the behavior, let's change the antecedent. Instead of walking down the hall with him, teach him a down-stay at one end of the hall. He can't herd you if he's in a down stay. And if you still want him with you, simply call him back to you and reward him heavily.

[RBark]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

Yeah, I'll look into getting that book.
I'm starting to get way confused on if I'm being mean or too gentle with my dog. So many people, here, vets, dog owners, family, tell me different things that are the "right" thing to do.
Of course I'd never hit or yell at my dog, but just saying "whatever, its my fault" seems to be him getting to be the dominate one.
Dominance has always been a bit of a struggle with me and my dog, I'm soft spoken and shy (in person) and I think he tries to take advantage of that and test his limits with me. He never does that with my boyfriend...

Maybe I should also speak to a dog trainer, or take some basic classes.

*EDIT* By the way, the collar shake was suggested by a few people here who own other herding dogs who were having similar issues with herding and domiance. It actually stopped the herding habits.

Let me give a little bit of perspective.

While I'm not soft spoken naturally, I generally will control my voice situationally. I speak in fast repeatitions to get my dogs to get moving, and slow down my speech to calm them down.

This was not trained, it was natural and something I see with any dog. Know how when someone bends over (play bow) and starts making fast movements, speaking fast "hey boy! hey boy! you haveing fun now!" and the dog gets excited? Translate that to how you are "correcting" your dog verbally. You likely are doing the exact same thing, and so, only getting him more energetic than less.

I can go, with any word, "googogoogogogogogogo" and magically, my dogs run full speed sprints. When I want to slow down, eaaaaaasssssssyyyyyy boyyssss and they slow down. The word I used didn't matter, but the way I said it.

Also, things such as dominance are best put behind your head for now. It's far too complex, and arguable to even begin to describe. As Curbside likes to put it often, dominance explanations will limit the possible reasons why your dog behaves the way he does.

Another thing is, my dogs, to anyone who wished to see things as such, will see that my dogs view me as "alpha" or the "dominant" one. And yet, I am far more easygoing than any dog owner I know. I allow my dogs to run, pull, dig, run in front of me, jump on me, sleep on the couch, on the bed, wherever they please. They go inside and outside as they please, if they seek attention from me, I give it. And yet, I am very obviously the "alpha". Why is this? There can be so many reasons for this, too many for a inexperienced person such as yourself and myself to even begin to try to explain.

So get rid of dominance ideas, and look more as 'undesirable behaviors" and "desirable behaviors". If the dog is doing EVERYTHING you desire, but considers itself an alpha, what do you care?

[Chelsea and Oskar]

Originally Posted by RBark

So get rid of dominance ideas, and look more as 'undesirable behaviors" and "desirable behaviors". If the dog is doing EVERYTHING you desire, but considers itself an alpha, what do you care?

That makes a lot of sense. I guess it really doesn't.
*edit*
I got so hung up on dominance I guess because I don't like it when he is rough with me/herding/humping/pulling He always listens to me, so I really am taking the wrong approach. I guess all these behaviors are normal puppy behaviors and we just have to build up training more. I've been working with one thing at a time, it gets overwhelming at times. I'll just have to keep at it, and invest in some classes to help me along.

[TooneyDogs]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

TooneyDogs: Scared maybe, but we seriously are just talking a little louder, nothing we do is rough or hard.

I know you aren't being physically being rough or hard. Dogs are masters of body language. That ticked off look that you give...they pick-up on that in a flash. Just moving towards the pup escalates that threat...raising your voice takes it to the next higher level and if you reach towards them they are at Defcon 1.
It takes very little to threaten or scare them. Let me give you an example of how powerful just a 'hard' look is...One of my students was having a problem with her 2 dogs dancing around the kitchen, getting underfoot, while she prepared supper. She tried shooing them out, telling them to leave.
I suggested she stop moving, stop talking and just give them a hard look....they both ran from the room. That whole body posture and look is often more than enough.

[Chelsea and Oskar]

That makes a lot of sence too, it seems so obvious once you explain it. I don't want to scare my dog, thinking about it I guess my boyfriend is really frightening to him. I can understand why he gets so "irrationally" upset.

I'm a novice dog owner. I loooove my puppy. You guys are so helpful, I really want to do all the right things for Oskar.

I also read over the NILIF (and will make sure boyfriend does too). Oskar really doesn't bug me for attention, but I'm making him listen, look and sit for me a lot more often. We already do the sit for food and door thing.

Sometimes I feel like "NO, bad puppy!" isn't enough though. He'll stop doing whatever he is doing, and then give me a big smiling face and sometimes go back to doing it. He stops when I say to, but he thinks its a game, like once I stop looking he can do it again. Maybe we just need to keep on training?

[Curbside Prophet]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

Sometimes I feel like "NO, bad puppy!" isn't enough though. He'll stop doing whatever he is doing, and then give me a big smiling face and sometimes go back to doing it. He stops when I say to, but he thinks its a game, like once I stop looking he can do it again. Maybe we just need to keep on training?

I would say give him more information. Telling him "NO!" doesn't explain to him what he should do. So, as part of your training, use instructive reprimands instead. Say he jumps on you...an instructive reprimand like "sit", not only can be your punishment, but it can also tell him what he should do. You may say "NO!" to jumping on you, but since "no" isn't very instructive, he may hump you instead. So teach him the behaviors you want.

[Chelsea and Oskar]

Gotcha. Thats a good place to start. Now I'll have to keep treats on me at all times so he forgets I have them.

Going from training time with treats, to rewards when he does what I say out of out exercises would be a good step to take too, right?

[Dana1384]

Originally Posted by RBark

It sounds like a confused puppy to me. I would recommend that you not do the collar shake and pick up the book "The Other End of the Leash". It will tell you far more than any of us can in a single thread.

.

You can also look into getting Culture Clash, It is by the same writter, and I am in the middle of reading it.

[Curbside Prophet]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

Gotcha. Thats a good place to start. Now I'll have to keep treats on me at all times so he forgets I have them.

Going from training time with treats, to rewards when he does what I say out of out exercises would be a good step to take too, right?

Reinforcers can be anything the dog enjoys. I personally don't like carrying treats around the house but when I'm teaching a new behavior I do consciously place small bowls of kibble (her daily ration of food) around the house in opportune places. Her kibble is very reinforcing for her.

That being said, if you dog knows drop, a short game of tug can be a reinforcer too. Or a chance to go outdoors can be a reinforcer. Sometimes even a belly rub can be a reinforcer.

I do like to start with food since it is a common reinforcer for most dogs and it quickly gets me the behavior I need. But yes, after he learns the behavior phase out the food for life rewards.

[Annamarie]

even though you're soft spoken normally, there is a difference between being "dominant" and being a bully. you can get your point across to the dog in a calm but assertive way without the anger or frustration in your voice or demeanor. I have a feeling you and your boyfriend are trying to dominate but are coming off to the dog (from his point of view) as an aggressor.

I would try giving the dog a command without touching him. You'd be surprised how effective body language can be with a dog. Teach him to go to his crate on command or put him in a down stay.

[French Ring]

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

Oskar (5 months) is very sweet and happy most of the time. However sometimes if he gets in trouble or we have something he wants and we ignore him he will bark at us, especially my boyfriend.

He is barking, whining, and nipping you and your boyfriend because it is about pack issue. What I can say is ignore and don't give any attention. If you tell Oskar "Stop or be quiet," you are giving him some attention. He doesn't care if he is getting a negative or postive attention, it is attention that he is seeking for. Don't give him ANY attention when he acts like that and you both need to act like he doesn't exist. Get up and go do your own things, fold your clothes, put dishes away, or whatever.

When he starts to calm down and be quiet, you both go over to praise him and say "good quiet or good boy." Don't over do your praise, because you don't need to excite him. Give him some attention such as taking him for a walk, play tug of war, or teach him a new cool trick. You need to reward him more for being quiet.

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

he does something like herd, bite too much, or try to dominate me, I’ll say “NO!” and sometimes grab his collar and give him a little shake (advised to me), or I’ll take him by the collar and walk him to the kitchen for a time out.

When you want to say Oskar "No," there is no reason to yell or scream at your dog. You just need to give a firm "No" with no yelling. Saying a serous " No" is different than screaming out of your lungs "NO."

When you are getting frustrated, I promise it affects Oskar's behavior more and more. He can see that you both are getting upset and it excites him. When you both give a good or bad reaction to his behavior, the more he wants it positive or negative.

A true pack leader is calm and fair so he doesn't scream, yell, or get too frustrated with his pack. When a dog isn't doing something right, do it again with out getting so upset. If he is doing something right, give a warm praise and say "Yes."

Originally Posted by Chelsea and Oskar

my boyfriend tells him “NO” or approaches him he hides under me and barks in defense (although its not an aggressive bark) and then he’ll make all these (really funny) noises, comparable to a child huffing and whining. If he keeps telling Oskar “NO! Don’t bark at me, no barking” he’ll sometimes growl.

Your boyfriend is making it worse than it should be. Like I explained above here, there's no reason to yell, get angry, or scream at your dog. When your dog misbehave, don't say 1 or 2 word to his behavior. Like I say, IGNORE him when he tries to nip, or whine.

Since you both are crazy about his barking, you need to teach him to "Bark" and "No Bark" on command with clicker. Reward his behavior with a food so he understands what "No bark" and "Bark" means. He doesn't understand when someone is telling him NO NO NO, STOP BARK, blah blah. He isn't a human, but a dog that doesn't understand what you both are saying.

I agree with other you both need to do NILIF and enroll ob class.

[Chelsea and Oskar]

We don't yell at him. We talk a little louder and firmer. I understand now that touching isn't nessicary. Seriously you make me sound like this crazy angry person, that isn't how it is.
We go about the whole thing calmly, when approching him its slow. I guess it is hard to describe exact actions in words.

Anway, I found a place near by recommended by a trainer I know and until May I'm doing more obediance training and putting it to use rather than just exercises.