[Angel061484]

Hi, Merlin (my yorkie) and I are new to the forums here.

Already, we have a need to post a thread and ask some questions. Merlin is having great difficulty using the bathroom in front of us. Lately he will hold his bowels til he can escape to a corner and we're not watching. Or he will wait til we are out of the house and go in the gated kitchen (sometimes on, sometimes not on the papers). Because we live on a third floor apartment building, and we don't have our own yard, and it's getting chilly outside, we decided to use papers/pee-pads. Merlin does well pee-ing on the papers, and will sometimes go on his own to pee on them, but he will hold his poo to high heaven until we aren't around. He does not have free reign of the apartment, and we keep a close watch on him, so close that he has almost no opportunity to go in a corner.

We have taken him to the vet and asked about this, but they say it's just a house-breaking difficulty we will have to overcome. Well I know it is not comfortable to hold your bowels for over 24 hours (it's been that long since the last time he pooed). Sometimes he'll go in front of us, and when he does we play big band music (praise him like crazy, and give him treats) But he only goes when he's gotta go so bad he can't hold it. We thought he might actually prefer to go outside but even outside (we've spent up to an hour and a half outside) he won't go.

He doesn't eat overly much, but you would expect a dog to need to go more often than once a day. Any advice?? Thanks so much!
~Merlin and his Mommy

[Snowshoe]

The vet thinks it's just a potty training issue, and he/she knows this puppy is holding its bowels for over 24 hours in a day?

I would seriously consider getting a new veternarian, or a least a second opinion.

Every young pup I've ever been around can usually hold it no more then an hour at a time- 2 hours at the most. For every month your dog ages, they should be able to hold their bowels one more hour.

If he/she is holding it that long, there may be another more serious problem then just potty training anxiety.

[blackgavotte]

Hi, I have some questions. Is he happy, active, bright eyed? Does his little tummy feel hard or distended? Do you get the sense he is tense or worried? Are his bowel movements firm or hard or soft or very soft? If all seems normal in all of the above, here is something else to consider.

Some puppies and dogs, just don't like to pee and poop in the same spot. Put some more papers and/or a pee pad in another area inside your gated place for him. The next time he poops wherever it is, when you pick it up with the kleenex, take it to that new spot, and just dab it on top of the papers or peepad. That will put a slight scent for him for the next time, hopefully. You may have to experiment with this to find the acceptable second spot, but I'd give that a try.

Sometimes you also have to make sure at first, the paper area is large enough for him to circle and sniff and feel he has some room. When he is loose, don't take your eyes off him for a minute, and be quick to pick him up and put him in his area immediately if he goes into a corner, or starts to circle. Once he is in his potty area, walk away and don't be near him, if he is embarrassed to have you there when he pottys. Lots of praise when he does perform in the right spot, and even while you are picking up the feces. Again, don't be overly fussy right now about getting all the papers up, he may need a bit more scent for awhile, he may be just a bit confused from the sound of it, but be sure to look at the physical aspects first for sure.

[Angel061484]

Thank you both so far for the suggestions. His bowels are not regular every time he goes, sometimes they are firm, other times my husband describes them as pudding. He gets skiddish even when we praise him. For the most part he's a happy dog, though he only eats about 1/4 cup of dry food a day and at this age the eukanuba bag says he should be eating 3/4 cup a days. Which is a considerable difference in food intake. When I mentioned this to the vet she gave us metronidazole, and because they were in such a rush (bad day at the vet hospital), even though I asked I didn't get a good explanation. I might try and take him to a new vet to see if I can get some straight answers. Thanks for the advice, and of course any more is always appreciated!

[skunkstripe]

Did anyone by chance schold him for pooing where he shouldn't have? Because if so, it may well BE a potty training issue and I would not be too quick to switch vets just yet. Dogs do not forget, and this is one of the most common mistakes that humans make when housebreaking.
Assuming that the stool looks normal I would keep up what you are doing with the big band music, except that I would make 150% sure that doggy is getting something REALLY great for pooing outside (with Zircon it turned out to be pig ears).

Good luck!

[Angel061484]

yes we scolded him, so that's probably part of the issue too, how do we fix that? The dog books don't give you help on that part. :-/

[foxywench]

i would switch to a better food than euke first, you want to find a food where the main ingredients arnt corn and By-products. this should help with the consistency with the waste.

then i would put down a couple of pads in the area hes usually confined to when not watched for now (once hes getting it right youll slowly decreese the area he has to go potty on)

becuas eh was scolded hes probably a bit conused. does he have a foavorite toy or treat?
perhaps the BIG praiseathon afterwards is too much high energy for him too...(some dogs are more skittish to excitment than others) instead try a simple happy "Good Puppy" and give him a gentle pet and a treat when you see him go (pee as well, i know pooping is the issue but if he learns its ok to go pee the poop should follow as he becomes more comfortable)
Or once every hour or so put him back in his gated area where his pads are and leave him for about 10 mins, walk away and give him a little privacy. if he doesnt go in that ten minutes let him out give him a gentle good boy and pet on the head (we want "his room" to stay a positive place) and let him play for a while, cuddle him play with him ect, and then after about an hour, return him again and leave him, give him that privicy again...
if he goes when you come back a sweet happy "good boy" and a treat and let him go play, make sure hes not in the room when you pick it up (or he might think by seeing you clean it that hes gone in the wrong place) and if you can leave a trace of it on the pad just to make sure the scnet stays to engourage him to go back to the same spot.

i think he might just be a slightly high strung puppy and thinks if he goes infornt of you he'll get in trouble...
lots of gentle praise, and patients and persistence should help.
and from now on instead of yelling no if he goes somewhere he shouldnt, have a squirt bottle or squirt gun with plain simple water in it, if you catch him in the act a quick squirt (but try not to let him see YOU doing it) and once he stops call him over give him a very quick fuss and put him in his area where the pad is and leave him his privicy.

good luck...its hard sometimes...some are very difficult to housetrain, what breed is he? some breeds are prone to being harder to train than others.

[skunkstripe]

Angel it CAN be fixed but it will take patience on your part. See your doggy is convinced that if you see him pooing you(or whoever scolded him) will be angry with him and he is trying to avoid that. As you can see, he is pretty good at it so the good news is that he can 'hold it', he wants to please you, and he is no dummy.
You pretty much have no choice but to outwait him so that he has no choice but to go in front of you and when he does boy, make sure you let him know "poo outside = good" and as foxywench said, maybe be more gentle with the praise. perhaps a scratch behind the ears and a soft word will be better.

I understand your reasons for wanting to use the pee pads, but it DOES confuse doggies because it makes it ok to go inside. They do not see as well as we do, so to them the pad is the same as a throw rug, etc etc. The main thing is how it smells. I think if it were me I would bite the bullet and either stick with eliminating outside, period OR designate some are for him inside to pee/poo. The other thing you can do is if/when you get him to go infront of you, repaeat a "cue word" in a happy, high pitched voice, like "go potty" or "hurry up", something he can assoicate with pooing.

Just remember, dogs do not forget, and they use doglogic, not people logic so you have to watch it with the scolding!

Good luck!

[pinkpuppy360]

Well I think you should get a different opinion from many vets. Afterall, they know best!