[shihtzu712]

Originally Posted by lovemygreys

Have you done ANYTHING other than google to try to educate yourself on REALITY? Or are you another "well, I read it on a website so it must be true" people?

http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/...ing_facts.html

I understand that you're passionate about your greyhounds and I know that you are probably a wonderful owner but the fact is that greyhound racing in the U.S. still has widespread issues. I appreciate the anecdotes that you bring to the discussion but I fear that your perspective may prevent you from seeing the abuses in the industry. It seems that the tracks that you race at and the groups you associate with are on the up and up. This doesn't mean that all tracks and groups are governed like this.

I don't want to start a flame war and I want to be respectful since I'm fairly new around here. I'll admit that I've never done in person "research" on the industry but if I can't believe what the Humane Society publishes I guess I don't know where else to go for my information. I do live about 45 minutes down the road from Dairyland Greyhound Track and I haven't heard about any issues with them so I apologize if I'm lumping all tracks and owners into one group, that's definitely not what I meant to do. Anyways, if you do have any information that can shed more light on things in the racing industry please share it with me. I'm always looking to learn new things and I'm definitely not above admitting I'm wrong.

[lovemygreys]

Originally Posted by shihtzu712

http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/...ing_facts.html

I understand that you're passionate about your greyhounds and I know that you are probably a wonderful owner but the fact is that greyhound racing in the U.S. still has widespread issues. I appreciate the anecdotes that you bring to the discussion but I fear that your perspective may prevent you from seeing the abuses in the industry. It seems that the tracks that you race at and the groups you associate with are on the up and up. This doesn't mean that all tracks and groups are governed like this.

You should do a little research on HSUS. They are a political, money raising organization. They do nothing to help actual greyhounds, nor do they care to. They're job is to raise money so they can pay their salaries and further a radical political agenda. Almost as bad as PETA...I say "almost" because as far as I know, HSUS doesn't directly kill animals like PETA. http://www.activistcash.com/organiza...ew.cfm/oid/136

Because gambling is involved, the care of racing greyhounds is highly regulated. There is no regulation for pets like there is for the care and transport of racing greyhounds. If you really want to save innocent animals, than advocate for the end of pet ownership...millions of animals are tortured, abused and abandoned at the hands of pet owners every year. MILLIONS of animals. That doesn't even count the misery and hell some animals endure to provide the pet industry with new puppies and kittens every year.

So...becareful where you point fingers. As a pet owner, you are part of a much larger cruelty.

Here's some additional sites if you are interested in the other side:
http://www.agtoa.com/
http://www.raceforadoption.com/
http://www.gra-america.org/

And a little something about me. I started out in adoption. I've owned greyhounds for about 7 years now. I've owned racing greyhounds about two of those years. So, my background is not racing. My roots are in adoption and the welfare of these animals. That is always the place I come from FIRST and FOREMOST. If you believe I have anything but the best interest of greyhounds at heart, then you are dead wrong.

I have been to SEVERAL tracks...not even the high end ones where dogs have their own whirlpool tubs. I've been to medium-to-low end tracks. I know what their daily lives are like. The happiest greyhounds I've seen have been in racing kennels. I remember the first time I walked into a racing kennel, expecting the worst only to see that happiest damn dogs I'd ever seen. Well socialized and well cared for. The trauma for racing greyhounds tends to come when they've been retired and their human family just wants them to hold down a sofa 23 hours a day and the dog no longer has their driving passion to look forward to -racing.

Like I said...I dont' care if someone is anti-racing. I accept that some folks believe the only acceptable place for a dog is as a family pet. I don't agree with that, but that's why we live in a free country. But at least base your beliefs on facts.

I'm not going to debunk every statement on the HSUS site...the truth is out there if you want to find it...BUT, for example, they point to the use of live lures and the killing of jacks as one of the many "evils" of the sport. But it has been illegal to use live animals to train greyhounds for many years now. If you get caught, you get banned from the sport by the NGA. Not to mention, why in the world would you train a racing dog on a live jack rabbit in an open field when their JOB is to chase a stuffed lure around an oval track? Makes no sense! You don't train a dog to do one job by teaching it to do a completely different activity.

Live coursing DOES happen...but it's done by non-racing folks...just regular ol' pet people who take their sighthounds (not just greyhounds). You may see this sport referred to as Open Field Coursing...an amateur hunting sport for sighthound fanciers. Nothing to do with greyhound racing.

p.s. I don't bring anecdotes to the table. I bring things I have seen and witnessed WITH MY OWN TWO EYES. You are taking the word of a controversial animal "rights" group who's interest is in getting you to send them your money.

I don't want to start a flame war and I want to be respectful since I'm fairly new around here. I'll admit that I've never done in person "research" on the industry but if I can't believe what the Humane Society publishes I guess I don't know where else to go for my information. I do live about 45 minutes down the road from Dairyland Greyhound Track and I haven't heard about any issues with them so I apologize if I'm lumping all tracks and owners into one group, that's definitely not what I meant to do. Anyways, if you do have any information that can shed more light on things in the racing industry please share it with me. I'm always looking to learn new things and I'm definitely not above admitting I'm wrong.

I will cede you the point that all tracks are NOT created equal. There is at least one track that would make me jump for freaking joy if it closed it's doors tomorrow. And I would not be the only one celebrating. It IS a dead end for too many greyhounds...

We aren't at 100% adoption yet. We will be at 100% adoption. If I had to guess, I'd say within 5-6 years. As tracks close and breedings continue to decline adopters will soon find themselves on long waiting lists to get a retired racer. I look forward to those days. The only way racing will get there is if we recognize the good and bad...the good racing folks turning in the a-holes. And it does happen. That's how racing has come so far in such a short period of time. 20+ years ago, nearly all greyhounds were euthanized when they were done racing. Thanks to trainers in the industry who actually started the movement for greyhound adoption, more greyhounds are adopted out every year than the year before.

I wish the pet industry could say the same thing. As a greyhound adoption person, I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. When it comes to other breed and mixed breed rescue, that light at the end of the tunnel seems more like a train.

[Dog_Shrink]

I stand by my comment and you (lovemygreys) are probably the acception rather than the rule. Any time an animal is used (or attempting to be used) as a money making machine I will be opposed. Sorry.

[RBark]

Originally Posted by Dog_Shrink

I stand by my comment and you (lovemygreys) are probably the acception rather than the rule. Any time an animal is used (or attempting to be used) as a money making machine I will be opposed. Sorry.

Hm, does that apply to sled dogs?

[Dog_Shrink]

That would all depend on what the motivation would be behind getting into sledding rbark... if it's to win pots of money yes... if it's to enjoy doing what your dog was bred to do then no.

[lovemygreys]

Originally Posted by Dog_Shrink

I stand by my comment and you (lovemygreys) are probably the acception rather than the rule. Any time an animal is used (or attempting to be used) as a money making machine I will be opposed. Sorry.

That's fine. You are free to have that opinion. I just hope you see that it's wrong to inflict your personal belief on my right to exercise my freedoms. The dogs have no idea money is involved. They are just as happy to race on the track or be out there lure coursing. At least with professional racing there is regulation and oversight that governs the welfare of the racing animals. There's no vet examining the welfare of dogs going to the dog park to make sure they are sound and fit to play.

I also hope you are opposed to pet ownership, otherwise you are a hypocrite. Millions of dollars are made off the backs of pets in this country. And they die by the millions in shelters when they are unwanted or inconvenient.

Personally, I see little difference between using a dog for personal enjoyment, entertainment and fulfillment (as a pet) and using a dog for what it loves to do - racing, pulling sleds, hunting, searching, etc....I prefer to take the approach that all activities with all dogs (and cats) should be done humanely and respectfully, whether the dog is a pet or a working animal. That's just my opinion. I wouldn't attempt to infringe on the rights of pet owners to own pets, just like I shouldn't have my rights infringed on to race dogs.

ooh...I just remembered that I once won $20 for a first placement in a lure coursing event. I've officially made more money at an amateur sport than the professional sport of greyhound racing! Ay yi yi...I needs to have a talk with my dogs! All of them!

[Dog_Shrink]

Originally Posted by lovemygreys

I also hope you are opposed to pet ownership, otherwise you are a hypocrite. Millions of dollars are made off the backs of pets in this country. And they die by the millions in shelters when they are unwanted or inconvenient.

Personally, I see little difference between using a dog for personal enjoyment, entertainment and fulfillment (as a pet) and using a dog for what it loves to do - racing, pulling sleds, hunting, searching, etc....I prefer to take the approach that all activities with all dogs (and cats) should be done humanely and respectfully, whether the dog is a pet or a working animal. That's just my opinion. I wouldn't attempt to infringe on the rights of pet owners to own pets, just like I shouldn't have my rights infringed on to race dogs.

That has got to be the silliest thing I have heard today. Pet owners make NO money by owning pets... the companies that make all the stuff we buy... hell yes... they make a TON. I'm talking about people who get animals solely for the intent of making a PROFIT off them whether it's racing, sledding or puppy milling. THAT is what I think is wrong. If you race your dogs, hunt your dogs, sled... whatever the dog was bred to do because they love it great... if you race or whatever in hopes that you can make a buck, then ditch the animal because it no longer is profitable then that's wrong.

[RBark]

Originally Posted by Dog_Shrink

That has got to be the silliest thing I have heard today. Pet owners make NO money by owning pets... the companies that make all the stuff we buy... hell yes... they make a TON. I'm talking about people who get animals solely for the intent of making a PROFIT off them whether it's racing, sledding or puppy milling. THAT is what I think is wrong. If you race your dogs, hunt your dogs, sled... whatever the dog was bred to do because they love it great... if you race or whatever in hopes that you can make a buck, then ditch the animal because it no longer is profitable then that's wrong.

So you're not against the sport, you're against irresponsible owners? A lot of people try to win money off the sport. But the dogs enjoy it too. When abuse comes into play, you're no longer talking about money. You're talking about irresponsibility.

Many mushers are in the sport to make the money. And the dogs get fed an awesome diet, get exercised more than the vast majority of dogs, and have the time of their lives in races. Sounds like a win win situation for the dogs and humans. I know you're going to qualify this statement with people who discard dogs or abuse them for the purpose of money. But like I said, that has to do with bad owners, not the sport. Bad owners exist in dog companionship too.

[lovemygreys]

Originally Posted by Dog_Shrink

That has got to be the silliest thing I have heard today. Pet owners make NO money by owning pets... the companies that make all the stuff we buy... hell yes... they make a TON. I'm talking about people who get animals solely for the intent of making a PROFIT off them whether it's racing, sledding or puppy milling. THAT is what I think is wrong. If you race your dogs because they love it great... if you race in hopes that you can make a buck then that's a different story.

As a pet owner, you fuel the industries that surround pets. If pet ownership ended today, then puppy mills go away. Trainers make money off pets...in fact, they bank on dogs having bad behavior!

Why is profit so wrong? You do realize that dogs have no clue one way or the other.

Why is owning a pet for one's selfish pleasure of having a dog regardless of what the dog wants superior to those who own a dog in hopes of making some money or earning a ribbon or a title* or whatever (though if that is someone's goal for getting into greyhound racing, then they are in the wrong sport!)? Sorry, but pet ownership is really no different than owning a performance animal. The human gets something out of it at the end of the day in both cases... You may want it to be different. But, it's not.

What if I get a dog with the intent of making money off of it AND it being my pet. Is that wrong?

*ribbon and title fiends can be insane when it comes to pushing their dog to perform. Not for money. For a ribbon or a title.

[nekomi]

Lovemygreys, I just want to post and say that you are amazing. As someone with an interest in racing dogs (sledding) and someone with experience with stupid laws (wolfdogs), I have to say how much I sincerely RESPECT and appreciate you and your passion for racing greyhounds.

I, for one, hope that your sport continues freely and that it can begin to recover its image in the public eye. It's because of your many posts that my image of greyhound racing went from HSUS-inspired, to realistic. So, thank you for putting up with ignorance in order to continue educating folks on your dogs and your sport.

[BoxMeIn21]

Originally Posted by nekomi

Lovemygreys, I just want to post and say that you are amazing. As someone with an interest in racing dogs (sledding) and someone with experience with stupid laws (wolfdogs), I have to say how much I sincerely RESPECT and appreciate you and your passion for racing greyhounds.

I, for one, hope that your sport continues freely and that it can begin to recover its image in the public eye. It's because of your many posts that my image of greyhound racing went from HSUS-inspired, to realistic. So, thank you for putting up with ignorance in order to continue educating folks on your dogs and your sport.

Amen to that.

[Dog_Shrink]

Once again... twisting my words... like I said... those that get/use the dog solely with the INTENT TO MAKE A PROFIT are wrong... enuff said.

[sparkle]

I find some truth in all the perspectives posted so I guess it is another one of those *DEPENDS* situations. Hopefully not a matter of absolutes .

[chul3l3ies1126]

Originally Posted by nekomi

Lovemygreys, I just want to post and say that you are amazing. As someone with an interest in racing dogs (sledding) and someone with experience with stupid laws (wolfdogs), I have to say how much I sincerely RESPECT and appreciate you and your passion for racing greyhounds.

I, for one, hope that your sport continues freely and that it can begin to recover its image in the public eye. It's because of your many posts that my image of greyhound racing went from HSUS-inspired, to realistic. So, thank you for putting up with ignorance in order to continue educating folks on your dogs and your sport.

<3

Originally Posted by BoxMeIn21

Amen to that.

Ditto

Nessa

[RBark]

Originally Posted by Dog_Shrink

Once again... twisting my words... like I said... those that get/use the dog solely with the INTENT TO MAKE A PROFIT are wrong... enuff said.

I am trying to understand what you are saying, not twist your words.

If someone uses a dog solely to make a profit, what's wrong with that if the dog is not abused, and is happy to do it's job? Or am I misunderstanding you?

[nekomi]

I agree 100% Rbark... as long as the dog is happy and well cared-for, I see absolutely no problem with it either.

[cshellenberger]

Originally Posted by shihtzu712

http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/...ing_facts.html

I understand that you're passionate about your greyhounds and I know that you are probably a wonderful owner but the fact is that greyhound racing in the U.S. still has widespread issues. I appreciate the anecdotes that you bring to the discussion but I fear that your perspective may prevent you from seeing the abuses in the industry. It seems that the tracks that you race at and the groups you associate with are on the up and up. This doesn't mean that all tracks and groups are governed like this.

I don't want to start a flame war and I want to be respectful since I'm fairly new around here. I'll admit that I've never done in person "research" on the industry but if I can't believe what the Humane Society publishes I guess I don't know where else to go for my information. I do live about 45 minutes down the road from Dairyland Greyhound Track and I haven't heard about any issues with them so I apologize if I'm lumping all tracks and owners into one group, that's definitely not what I meant to do. Anyways, if you do have any information that can shed more light on things in the racing industry please share it with me. I'm always looking to learn new things and I'm definitely not above admitting I'm wrong.

HSUS is no better that PETA, they spread misinformation about many things, sledding and track racing are only a small part of the misinformation and lies they spread. (Both oragnazations are backers of BSL legislation and manditory euth of certain breeds)

That said, it's already been started that only a fraction of these dogs haven't already been either redirected to other tracks or accepted into rescue and that NONE that are adoptable are in danger of euthinization. Obviously the original call for help was a group that was either sadly misinformed or trying to start trouble for the the track and the racing industry in general.

As far as racing and sledding being lumped in with Puppy Milling, I can gaurantee you it's NOT the same. The dogs are given a purpose, if they aren't happy on the track they are adopted out to very thouroughly screened homes as pets and sent ther with Spay/nueter. They recieve excellent health care from BIRTH to the grave, VERY unlike Puppy milling.

[Shalonda]

PETA doesn't even want folks to keep dogs as pets so I don't know why anybody on this board would listen to anything they have to say. They kill tons of adoptable pets is what I heard. They make a big fuss about stupid things like the president swatting a fly. They are more worried about how he treats some nasty insect than about how he's handling the economy or the war. They are a bunch of nuts who only hurt the cause of animal welfare.

[Kyllobernese]

Thank goodness Lovemygreys is on here to set people straight on Greyhound racing. The people against it must have never seen the joy in a Greyhounds eye as they race around whether it is on the track or in someones open field. People do not stay in either the Greyhound racing or Horse Racing very long if they do not look after their animals. I have had Greyhounds in the past both off the track and raising them. They do not have Greyhound racing in Canada (at least not pari-mutual tracks) so you do not often see Greyhounds. The only track I have ever been at was Multnomah Racetrack in Washington State. I don't even know if they are still in operation.

[Leroy&Lucy'sMom]

Originally Posted by Kyllobernese

Thank goodness Lovemygreys is on here to set people straight on Greyhound racing.

Heather and Ken are AMAZING people. The hounds thank you for everything you've done!