Spanking -- What would you do?

zimandtakandgrrandmimi · 10-05-2008, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AirForceAngel

I'm only 5'3" and I weigh 125 lbs. Lolz. I'd still get in someone's face if I honestly thought they were in the wrong.

I use my confidence and in-your-face attitude to intimidate people, though. Lolz.

Haahahaha..I am about your size and I have HIT people to make them lay off their dogs on one or two occasions. The biggest instance occurred over a dog I ended up owning. She was wearing a collar that cut into her neck and bald from mange..half her proper weight HW positive and he was hitting her with a rock in his fist. I punched that cabron in his heartless face!

but that is beside the point.

Dakota Spirit · 10-05-2008, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackrose

On the note of spanking....no, I don't agree with it, but I don't find it abuse. Shoot, a neighbor would chase her dogs with a broom when they left their property and she'd give them a sweeping whack with it on the behind. The dogs weren't injured and they are very well taken care of. If that is abuse, then what is someone who beats the sh*t out of their dog every time it jumps on the couch, shocks it with an e-collar when it isn't laying down quietly, and has the dog so scared that every time it sees the owner it goes belly up and pees, which it then gets beat for? (And yes, a lady I used to work with had a neighbor who did just that to their American Bulldog.)

Agreed. While I may not particularly care for spanking, there are so many OTHER things out there I would rather concentrate on. When it comes to abuse I think it's more important to go after the the bigger cases, the situations where a dog is clearly being mistreated. This IMO, is not one of them.

That's not to say hitting can't be abuse, I just don't consider a small swat on the butt to fall into that category.

zimandtakandgrrandmimi · 10-05-2008, 01:48 PM

Seriously MoonStr80

Think abouut what you saw. We can only go on your description of the event. So think about what you saw and if the dog was in clear pain and terror you should call. If you aren't sure..you should keep an eye out and be vigilant and perhaps depending you should try to approach these people....

my shiny two pence

NocturneWolf · 10-05-2008, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobSD

I know some will not agree with me but, I would pick the dog up and take it home with me to live the good life!

That's called theft, and unlike hitting a dog (hitting, not abusing) that is illegal.

Criosphynx · 10-05-2008, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NocturneWolf

That's called theft, and unlike hitting a dog (hitting, not abusing) that is illegal.

hmm....just me...but when i find a loose dog...with no tags...i take the thing to the shelter ..

if its loose IMO with no tags...they must not really want the thing. Theres nothing illegal about taking a loose dog to the pound. Even if you know where it lives.

Dakota Spirit · 10-05-2008, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Criosphynx

hmm....just me...but when i find a loose dog...with no tags...i take the thing to the shelter ..

if its loose IMO with no tags...they must not really want the thing. Theres nothing illegal about taking a loose dog to the pound. Even if you know where it lives.

True, however BobSD said he would be taking the dog home with him. Knowing where it lives and ignoring that fact so that you keep the animal IS illegal. Regardless of how you feel about their training techniques.

I don't think anyone would fault you for taking the dog to a shelter, though. Thats what I call 'training' a person not to let their pets run free

Criosphynx · 10-05-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota Spirit

True, however BobSD said he would be taking the dog home with him. Knowing where it lives and ignoring that fact so that you keep the animal IS illegal. Regardless of how you feel about their training techniques.

I don't think anyone would fault you for taking the dog to a shelter, though. Thats what I call 'training' a person not to let their pets run free

oh, sorry

, i must have missed that part.. yes you can't keep the thing. Its got to go downtown...

i've trained a neighbor or two.

AirForceAngel · 10-07-2008, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimandtakandgrrandmimi

Haahahaha..I am about your size and I have HIT people to make them lay off their dogs on one or two occasions. The biggest instance occurred over a dog I ended up owning. She was wearing a collar that cut into her neck and bald from mange..half her proper weight HW positive and he was hitting her with a rock in his fist. I punched that cabron in his heartless face!

but that is beside the point.

And that's the way it should be!

squirmyworm · 10-07-2008, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NocturneWolf

Isn't reporting someone for hitting a dog taking it too far? How many here would even report a mother that gave her kid a whack on the behind for being a brat? There's a line betwen spanking or giving a dog/kid a whack on the butt and giving a dog a beating or abusing it. I mean, if you saw the guy drop kick the dog or really go at him enough to do some real damage then I can see it as abuse.

Comparing the spanking of a dog with the spanking of a child is not an appropriate comparison, IMO. You can explain to a child why you're spanking him/her. You cannot explain your actions to a dog, and thus a "spanking" for a dog is similar to a family member randomly hitting you for (apparently) no reason. One could make the case that spanking is a training tool, but probably in the vast majority of cases, the spanking is not timed correctly to count as positive punishment. Like this: dog does something "bad," owner calls the dog, owner spanks dog. I would consider that abuse, because it has no training value. In my opinion, "abuse" is a relative term, and its occurrence can really only be determined by context, on a case-by-case basis. Given this context, I would say that this neighbor is "abusing" their dog.

OP - if you have a good relationship with your neighbors, I would approach them personally. If you don't, or if that approach doesn't work, I'd call AC. Maybe they'll change their ways after being approached by officials. Or, they'll simply stop spanking their dog outside (let's hope not).

Tailes · 10-07-2008, 09:39 AM

I would say..
A loose dog with no tags .. goes to a shelter..
I can only go from what youve explained off as some uneducated dog owners. Spanking should NEVER be used as a correction in my book. You can nudge, command, pull, or praise.. but Spanking serves no purpose ESPECIALLY if it is done LONG after the fact of the bad behaviour.

I think if anyone needs a spanking in this story its the OWNER!!!!

but that is my opinion..

MoonStr80 · 10-07-2008, 01:51 PM

This is no mistake I saw what I saw with my own eyes! He was ANGRILY spanking this little dog. It was no training involved whatsoever

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimandtakandgrrandmimi

Seriously MoonStr80

Think abouut what you saw. We can only go on your description of the event. So think about what you saw and if the dog was in clear pain and terror you should call. If you aren't sure..you should keep an eye out and be vigilant and perhaps depending you should try to approach these people....

my shiny two pence

SamiLynNewJersey · 10-07-2008, 02:19 PM

when my dogs are being real bad they do get a smack on the hine & told BAD DOG! It does not hurt them physically, but it does hurt there feelings, there is a big difference in a spanking & a beating.

Filnyyena · 10-07-2008, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by squirmyworm

Comparing the spanking of a dog with the spanking of a child is not an appropriate comparison, IMO. You can explain to a child why you're spanking him/her.

I think it is an appropriate comparison. Do you honestly believe a child can comprehend why they are being hit, caused physical pain by his mother or father, to the point of tears? Well, a dog can't cry tears. Does that mean it is OK to continue to beat on him?

Spanking of a child to the degree this person spanked his dog is considered child abuse.. Heck, spanking at all is considered child abuse NO matter your reasons or even if the child understands why he is being spanked. My friend got removed from his mother's care because of this. And really, you can try and rationalize why you are spanking your child, but the child won't understand.

http://www.americanpoems.com/poets/annesexton/8949

Lovely poem illustrating just this.

WHAT makes a DOG different from a CHILD? They view you the same, they are able to feel pain, they cannot comprehend it just as much as a child is able to. They may draw the correlation between Action A causes Action B, but 15minutes after the fact? They won't even remember what they did wrong!

ANYTHING, any type of reprimand, hit, correction, anything that is overly done, regardless of if you are a DOG or a CHILD, is abuse. The only thing that saves us humans from the guilt of harming a dog, is THAT mentality of "It is just a dog. I can be pounding my kid right now. But I am hitting my dog instead."

Comparing the abuse to a child to the abuse of a dog IS an appropriate comparison. The only thing that separates the two is the LAW. It is NOT ok to hit a child, where as it IS ok to hit a dog.

squirmyworm · 10-07-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Filnyyena

I think it is an appropriate comparison. Do you honestly believe a child can comprehend why they are being hit, caused physical pain by his mother or father, to the point of tears? Well, a dog can't cry tears. Does that mean it is OK to continue to beat on him?

Spanking of a child to the degree this person spanked his dog is considered child abuse.. Heck, spanking at all is considered child abuse NO matter your reasons or even if the child understands why he is being spanked. My friend got removed from his mother's care because of this. And really, you can try and rationalize why you are spanking your child, but the child won't understand.

http://www.americanpoems.com/poets/annesexton/8949

Lovely poem illustrating just this.

WHAT makes a DOG different from a CHILD? They view you the same, they are able to feel pain, they cannot comprehend it just as much as a child is able to. They may draw the correlation between Action A causes Action B, but 15minutes after the fact? They won't even remember what they did wrong!

ANYTHING, any type of reprimand, hit, correction, anything that is overly done, regardless of if you are a DOG or a CHILD, is abuse. The only thing that saves us humans from the guilt of harming a dog, is THAT mentality of "It is just a dog. I can be pounding my kid right now. But I am hitting my dog instead."

Comparing the abuse to a child to the abuse of a dog IS an appropriate comparison. The only thing that separates the two is the LAW. It is NOT ok to hit a child, where as it IS ok to hit a dog.

Let me clarify a few things.

First of all, in NO WAY do I condone the throwing of children across a room, as was illustrated in the poem you posted. Are you seriously implying that I find that kind of behavior acceptable? Did my words really deserve that kind of hostile response?

In addition to that, I NEVER, not once in my post did I condone spanking a child. I didn't say "because kids can understand it, it's ok." I merely attempted to illustrate the differences between the two situations. I am not a parent, and I have no authority on the subject either way. All I have is my own experience when I was a young child (my parents spanked me, but never to the point of causing pain) and that doesn't qualify me to give advice on parenting.

Again, the only thing I did in my post was illustrate the difference between a child and a dog. And here is where I think the communication breakdown happened. You can't tell me that a four-five year old child cannot understand why they get a spanking. I sure did when I was young. Maybe you were talking about toddlers? In contrast, I'm pretty sure a dog really wouldn't understand (though I'm sure this statement will be debated). That changes the context of the situation. Is spanking an ethically acceptable tool when working with a child who can understand why? I don't have the answer to that question at this point in time. I know that, legally, it's not always considered abuse. Is spanking ethically acceptable when working with a dog who doesn't understand why it's being hit? I can give that a definitive no.

I can see how you may have interpreted my post as condoning what you call abuse. Regardless, I don't think that my comments, however interpreted, justified the insinuations that I mentioned above. Next time, ask for clarification before you make heinous, hurtful accusations.

EDIT: In case you were wondering, I do not spank my dog.