[B-Line]

Originally Posted by MollyDoggie

Anyone ever lion cut a doodle?

Shhhhh, (don't let the PWD breeders hear me say this...)

But, PLEASE, PLEASE, don't do it... I loathe the lion clip.

[poodleholic]

(And I'm pretty sure that poodles- especially spoos- are smarter than quite a few people I know. :P)

ROFLMAO! Oh, Dogstar, so true! SO true!

[Quincy]

Originally Posted by B-Line

Vs. Pristine examples of Doodle's

Oh I just noticed you used my Quincy's photo in the opening to this thread. I haven't got time to read all the thread, so what would you like to know about my Quincy, and where you seem to want to do some sort of "Compare and Contrast"
.

[dog-man]

Originally Posted by MollyDoggie

Anyone ever lion cut a doodle?

no, but i've done a mohawk.

[B-Line]

Unfortunately, my girls got conjunctivitis. Maggie in her left eye first, then spread to her right eye, then Nikita got it in her right eye. I think Maggie got it in the small dog park by my office.

My point being, I took them to the vet today and they were weighed.

Nikita, 12 - weighs 53lbs. she is down from a top weight of 63lbs.
Maggie, 6 months - weighs a whopping 37lbs. already.

[KaseyT]

PWDs seem like wonderful dogs. Why are there so few of them?

[dog-man]

Originally Posted by KaseyT

PWDs seem like wonderful dogs. Why are there so few of them?

it seems they were first accepted by AKC in 1984.

[B-Line]

Originally Posted by KaseyT

PWDs seem like wonderful dogs. Why are there so few of them?

The million dollar question.. !

I would say, there are a number of factors, here is my best guess:

1) As of 1970, the breed was EXTREMELY close to instiction. There were only 50 known PWD's in the entire world. It wasn't until a famous shipping tycoon discovered the dogs on a trip to Portugal, feel in love with one, and made it his mission to rescue the breed, that the breed became known. It is argued that advancements in fishing technology, commercial, long line fishing, radar, etc. made the breed less vital to the fisherman.

2) The breed was then slowly popularized in the United States and have spent the past 40 years becoming greater in number. But still, are minute in number compared to the traditional, popular, dog breeds.

3) The breeders tend to be "guardians" of the breed. They are very careful about whom they allow to adopt a PWD. 12 years ago, when I got Nikita, there were long waiting lists for puppies. Now, it's not so hard, because there are more breeders, but for the most part, they make you jump through some hoops to get one. It's not a snobbery thing, or an elitist thing, quite the contrary. I think the breeders really prefer not to see people back yard breeding. That is also the same reason, the few examples you do see of the breed, are generally so high. I've also never seen a PWD in a dog store window or advertized in a local paper. There just not breed in mass quantity like that.

4) More does not always equal better. I think the PWD has largely benefited by not having it be more popular. Popularity generates financial motives and in my experience, PWD breeders only sell their dogs to recoup their expenses. Once you start bringing in the "Greed Breeders", a lot of quality falls to the waist side.

5) I actually do think, since I got my first PWD, that the dogs are becoming more well known and recognized. They are such amazing pets and most people that have spent any time around one, immediately want one.

-- A funny side note.. As far as my research goes, you know who the most famous of all PWD owners has been:
Who else: Jacques Cousteau !! LOL..

[Quincy]

Originally Posted by dog-man

it seems they were first accepted by AKC in 1984.

I think the PWD probably was on the Foundation Stock Service listing for some time till being recognized as a breed by the AKC. On the AKC website at the very bottom of their Breed Standard I see some dates mentioned Approved January 15, 1991 and Effective February 27, 1991
.

Originally Posted by B-Line

As of 1970, the breed was EXTREMELY close to instiction. There were only 50 known PWD's in the entire world.

Today some are quite concerned regarding some breeds, and in the past there were breeds who became extinct. Take for example the "Cavalier King Charles Spaniel" which became extinct and were recreated in the 1920s from the "King Charles Spaniel" and those that did the recreation were tight lipped as to what other breeds they may have used. Since recreation they had to be very carefull on a number of things, and with only so many of them particularly Coefficient of Inbreeding (COI) and by Kennel Club records the last time a "King Charles Spaniel" was used was 1980.

Talking of Coefficient of Inbreeding (COI) what is your PWD's COI, my dog's is ZERO and has been that for 3 generations. Well you did seem to want to do some sort of "Compare and Contrast"
.

[Pai]

Originally Posted by B-Line

Shhhhh, (don't let the PWD breeders hear me say this...)

But, PLEASE, PLEASE, don't do it... I loathe the lion clip.

Aw, I love it -- it makes them look so unique, I think! But then, I like unusual-looking dogs, lol. =)
I don't like the clip at all in Lowchens, however, it just looks silly on them, imo. I think it's the difference in hair texture that makes it look good on one breed but not on another.

[Quincy]

People do like different "haircuts and styles" even on their dogs, and one can even see this in the show rings around the world. Say here are some "haircuts and styles" for Poodles via this link:-
http://www.poodlesinaustralia.com/trims.html

And Pai, we could talk about Cresteds even in this thread
.

[Pai]

I actually like the corded Poodles a lot... that's a really old fashioned style for them, ya? It must take a lot of work though.

Originally Posted by Quincy

And Pai, we could talk about Cresteds even in this thread
.

lol!

[Quincy]

Originally Posted by Pai

I actually like the corded Poodles a lot... that's a really old fashioned style for them, ya? It must take a lot of work though.

Well you will find people who love and are totally nuts about their dogs that they do not see it as a lot of work but quite the opposite in a sort of pleasurable way where they spend time with their dogs. Some feel the same even though they may like some sort of "non-trimmed natural look" but still spend time with their dogs doing other things even if just lounging about together. Well I think you understand what I mean

Yeah LOL
.

[Canadian Dog]

I wasn't aware of PWD until after I got Molly. A breeders website had indicated this was a breed that couldn't be off leash, but I have learned since this is not the case. There was one in the tricks class I attended with Molly and I was very impressed - very attentive to its owner and willing to please, and a beautiful dog. If I were considering getting another dog I would definitely consider a PWD and in fact probably would have gotten one if I had known of the breed.

I have been bashed on this forum for owning my mix and also on a doodle forum for questioning the prices asked compared to what purebred dogs cost. I had also stated I couldn't recommend anyone buying these mixes because of the unpredictability of the coats. Many owners end up shaving the dogs when they blow their puppy coat because of the matting. The administrator of the forum was not happy with me at all and basically gave me a bull$hit answer.

Molly seems to be at the end of the dreaded blowing of the puppy coat and I've managed to keep her long. I rake and comb her every day as I have the time and desire to do so, but I can't imagine someone with children, job etc spending at least an hour a day grooming their dog during this coat change. I have no idea what the requirements are for grooming a PWD.

[Quincy]

Originally Posted by Canadian Dog

I had also stated I couldn't recommend anyone buying these mixes because of the unpredictability of the coats. Many owners end up shaving the dogs when they blow their puppy coat because of the matting.

There are many mix bred dogs, which ones are you referring too?

And I better add what other things like size for instance, where a large dog may require more grooming time than if that same dog was of a small size.
.

[Canadian Dog]

Originally Posted by Quincy

There are many mix bred dogs, which ones are you referring too?

And I better add what other things like size for instance, where a large dog may require more grooming time than if that same dog was of a small size.
.

Sorry, I was referring to Golden Retriever/Standard Poodle which Molly is (F1B). She is 11 months and 52 lbs.

[Quincy]

Originally Posted by Canadian Dog

Sorry, I was referring to Golden Retriever/Standard Poodle which Molly is (F1B). She is 11 months and 52 lbs.

I'm sorry too, I cannot respond further as I've had no practical experience with coats on such a dog. If you've got practical experience I'm willing to listen
.

[Canadian Dog]

Originally Posted by Quincy

I'm sorry too, I cannot respond further as I've had no practical experience with coats on such a dog. If you've got practical experience I'm willing to listen
.

Perhaps you were under the impression my original post was responding to yours - it was not - it was regarding the OP comparing PWD and doodles. It had nothing to do with your post.

[borzoimom]

Originally Posted by Laurelin

This is a question I proposed on another forum...

How different does a breed need to be in order to be acceptable? There are tons of breeds that are very similar and perform similar jobs. Which ones are okay and which are just 'repeats'?...

Most of the main reasons why so many breeds are similar in function, is the difference ( by sheer distance) of the country of origin. If you look at the country of origin in many of the retrievers, and remember at the dates of origin, travel was limited.
As far as the PWD many years ago I had a co-worker that had this breed. One of the reasons as to why was because of their intellegence, their size, but also mostly because they did not have the genetic problems in the breeds as the poodles did. Also obviously more of a medium size dog. Delightful charming intellegent dogs.

On animal planet " breed all about it" the PWD is coming on in a few minutes..

[flipgirl]

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the poodle originate from the PWD? What is a doodle? All I know is that it's what I do when I'm bored at a meeting.