[poodleholic]

yes, i do think Oinest is extraordinary...and i do like to be the center of attention if i can make it fun (not when it gets ugly).

however, the purpose of initiating the thread was not to focus on Oinest, and convince people of anything.

first, i wanted to get feedback from others on their own experiences with the "human" qualities of their dogs...

to discuss, in general, the emotional depth of dogs...

to discuss possible differences among the breeds...

and more.

Dogman, you sure did go about it in a roundabout way! What you stated in the above post is what you should have said in the first place! LOL

Maybe you're simply not able to articulate just what you mean when you talk about the emotional depth and level of connection, communication, and understanding that you have with oinest. I would have a hard time describing the emotional intimacy and claity of communication that I have with Maddy. She will be 7 yrs. old in May. My kids, who initially couldn't understand the relationship I had with Maddy, get it, now. Because of what they've observed over the years. Instead of rolling their eyes when talking about mom's dogs, they're the first ones who will tell people, "That Maddy is NOT a dog. That's a person!" LOL She is pretty incredible. Beau, my rescue, is pretty phenominal, himself. Highly intelligent, he was wary when he first came to live with Maddy and me. He's learned to trust again, and he's opened up that big heart of his, eyes shining with joy. Even children who are afraid of dogs just fall in love with my bigga, bigga, hunka love!

So, DogMan, please share with us little vignettes of oinest, so we can better understand what you're talking about.

[Ella'sMom]

Originally Posted by Two Labs Mom

I would agree that many, many people underestimate dogs. In my lifetime, I cannot count how many times people told me they preferred cats to dogs because dogs are just plain 'stupid.' I am continually amazed at the things dogs do on their own as well as the things they can be taught to do. I've probably had a couple dozen dogs in my lifetime and each was so different from the others, but each was very special and gifted in their own way.

We lost our wonderful black lab, Moose, to cancer a little over a year ago. He was a real handful, super spirited, stubborn. He was a big boy (over 100 pounds) and he was like a bull in china shop - knocking over furniture, lamps, etc., stepping all over people's feet, bumping into them and almost knocking them over .... probably my fault for not teaching him better manners when he was younger. But with my autistic son, he was calm, careful, and completely devoted. If my son would have a screaming tantrum, everybody else would clear the room to protect their hearing (and their nerves) but Moose would stop what he was doing and go to my son. He wouldn't force himself on him, he would just sit by him, gently lick his hand, or put his head in his lap and just wait for the tantrum to be over. When it was over, Moose would watch him very carefully and follow him from room to room. Sometimes the two of them would sit together, stare into each other's faces and just 'connect' somehow. I don't know how you would explain it - he never did that with anyone else in our house, just my son. He treated him with a gentleness, and - dare I say it - a respect that he didn't give to anyone else.

So yes, I believe that dogs have way more depth than many people give them credit for.

But I would also agree that some people place far too much 'human' baggage on dogs. I know he's not real popular here, but if you watch The Dog Whisperer, you'll see that a great number of people with problem dogs are people who put human characteristics on their dogs and expect them to think and behave like people. They say things like, "Oh, I didn't want to correct that behavior because I didn't want to hurt his feelings," or "I know she's only acting up because she is worried that she is going to be abandoned and she wants to make sure she can trust me," and blah blah blah. He had a lady on the other day who was so whiny and wimpy with her dog and using so much human psychobabble to explain the dog's behavior that I just wanted to slap her around! I don't always agree with Cesar, but I do like that he tells people straight up that DOGS ARE NOT PEOPLE so don't treat them like people.

I don't know what point I'm trying to make. LOL I guess I'm just trying to say that people can both underestimate and overestimate dogs. Underestimate them by thinking they are just stupid dogs who don't know anything and then overestimating them by treating them as if they were human and assuming that they think and act and feel the same way humans do.

Hope that makes sense ... I know what I'm wanting to say just not sure I explained it very well. LOL

Wow that is amazing. Thanks for sharing that story about Moose and your son. These are the things that make me love dogs even more.

[Two Labs Mom]

Originally Posted by Ella'sMom

Wow that is amazing. Thanks for sharing that story about Moose and your son. These are the things that make me love dogs even more.

Thank you.

I still miss old Moose. Remnants of him are still around our house ... chipped lamps, gouges in the drywall, teethmarks on chair legs ... LOL We talked about replacing some of the stuff but we're not ready yet. They are sweet reminders of a great dog.

[Spicy1_VV]

Ok I finally got a chance to check this out. Sounds like Oinest is like my dogs. So how is he/they like Mr Ed.

The first post really reminds me of our female that a friend just mentioned last month. It was very similar to your experience. She remembered it and was talking about it.

[spotted nikes]

Originally Posted by pamperedpups

Maybe it's just my area, but I don't see very many humans sitting in cars with balls in their mouths...

I guess you just need to hang out where there are ex-presidents, NY Mayors, and Congressmen....

[terryjeanne]

Originally Posted by Two Labs Mom

Thank you.

I still miss old Moose. Remnants of him are still around our house ... chipped lamps, gouges in the drywall, teethmarks on chair legs ... LOL We talked about replacing some of the stuff but we're not ready yet. They are sweet reminders of a great dog.

Sort of like not covering up the wall where you've measured the kids' heights every year

[Canadian Dog]

Originally Posted by spotted nikes

I guess you just need to hang out where there are ex-presidents, NY Mayors, and Congressmen....

Now that is funny!

[Dakota Spirit]

Ok - just because this comment seems to be reoccurring,

I think I understand what the reference was to Mr. Ed. I think dog-man is making the connection that Mr. Ed was a horse portrayed with a lot of human-like qualities. He related to the other characters in the show, spoke, etc. Now Oinest doesn't speak - but I think dog-man is simply trying to point out the 'human qualities' he sees in him by suggesting that he behaves and relates in a way that Mr. Ed did (ie. he interacts with people at a very social level).

Now, I've expressed disagreement with dog-man in the past but I think that this point alone can be dropped. We need not be so literal and pick apart every little thing. No Oinest isn't a talking horse, but I very much doubt that was the point dog-man was trying to make.

[Canadian Dog]

I know what Dog-man was saying. He's not the only one that feels this way about his dog. Plus, Dog-man is quite capable of defending himself and his posts.

[Dakota Spirit]

Originally Posted by Canadian Dog

I know what Dog-man was saying. He's not the only one that feels this way about his dog. Plus, Dog-man is quite capable of defending himself and his posts.

I never said he was the only one - in fact I didn't even address those issues.

I well aware of your other point as well. However, since the question kept coming up I figured I'd give my thoughts on it. This is a public forum. I may post as I see fit, provided it's within the rules.

Thank you.

[Canadian Dog]

Originally Posted by Dakota Spirit

I never said he was the only one - in fact I didn't even address those issues.

I well aware of your other point as well. However, since the question kept coming up I figured I'd give my thoughts on it. This is a public forum. I may post as I see fit, provided it's within the rules.

Thank you.

Hey, sorry, I didn't mean you shouldn't post - just my opinion.

[Dakota Spirit]

Originally Posted by Canadian Dog

Hey, sorry, I didn't mean you shouldn't post - just my opinion.

No problem. I'm sorry if I took it the wrong way.

[Spicy1_VV]

Originally Posted by Dakota Spirit

Ok - just because this comment seems to be reoccurring,

I think I understand what the reference was to Mr. Ed. I think dog-man is making the connection that Mr. Ed was a horse portrayed with a lot of human-like qualities. He related to the other characters in the show, spoke, etc. Now Oinest doesn't speak - but I think dog-man is simply trying to point out the 'human qualities' he sees in him by suggesting that he behaves and relates in a way that Mr. Ed did (ie. he interacts with people at a very social level).

Now, I've expressed disagreement with dog-man in the past but I think that this point alone can be dropped. We need not be so literal and pick apart every little thing. No Oinest isn't a talking horse, but I very much doubt that was the point dog-man was trying to make.

So basically he's like many other dogs out there. Although not all, but plenty others. So what makes him so fab then? Maybe thats what I'm missing.

[Dakota Spirit]

Originally Posted by Spicy1_VV

So basically he's like many other dogs out there. Although not all, but plenty others. So what makes him so fab then? Maybe thats what I'm missing.

Lol, I'm certainly not arguing that he's unique in that sense. He's fabulous in that he's Oinest, but beyond that I think his relationship with dog-man is much the same as those many of our members share.