Explanation of "Heat"

Dogged · 12-03-2006, 03:42 AM

And yet the AVMA endorses it.

http://www.avma.org/issues/policy/an...pay_neuter.asp

blackgavotte · 12-03-2006, 02:54 PM

Yes, they do endorse it, probably largely because of the shameful situation of shelters and luckless, pathetic animals that come into the world just to be euthanized after sometimes a really miserable life. I fully understand why they do support it. Note also that they leave discretion and opinion up to each veterinarian.

There will always be dissenting views on this, as on so many other subjects. That's part of being human. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one, though no one cares more than I, about trying to stop the indiscriminate breeding of dogs, and the fact that when we have dogs, they are entitled to a minimum standard of life with us, otherwise we should not have them.

But that's a whole 'nother thread.

opokki · 12-03-2006, 03:27 PM

The DogListener as well as a few others had previously posted some interesting information on early spay/neuter, which got me thinking. I will definately have to do much research on the subject before getting my next dog altered.

I completely trust my vet. She really seems to keep up to date on everything, attends many seminars and even teaches. So I did not question her when she recommended Natalie be spayed at 4 months of age. At that time, much of the information I'd come across gave me the impression that this was fine and even benefical.

Having said that, most of the dogs I know have been spayed/neutered early, at 6 months of age or younger, so it will be interesting to see if any behavior/health issues arise down the road.

So far, one Shih Tzu has suffered from a UTI and later had to have 108 stones surgically removed from her bladder. Whether or not this has anything to do with her being spayed at 4 months of age, I can not say but none of the other dogs seem to have suffered any ill effects.

DogAdvocat · 12-03-2006, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by atldoglover

The first cockapoo that I ever owned, we spayed at 6 months. However, this go round, we are getting a boy and a girl (CKC registered) so that we can breed once. Since I have never dealt with this before, can someone please explain how often a dog goes through heat and what the ramifications are. I was told by the breeder that I am getting the puppies from that we had to wait 2 years before breeding, so I just want to be totally informed. Thanks in advance,

One of the myths that is so attractive to those who love their dog and want one just like them is that such a thing is even possible. Think about your own family. Are you just like anyone in your family - I doubt it. Even siblings have different personalities. Frequently offspring is more like one of their grandparents than like their parents. And what's sad is that people are often disappointed when the pups are not like the parents, and they never quite form the same bond they did with the beloved parent dog. That's unfair to the pup, and has risked a lot of their lives. People have a tendency of grieving for their old dog, and then being disappointed because the new dog (whether bought or bred) can't compete with the glowing memory of how fast the old dog learned, or how well it behaved - often forgetting what a problem-child it might have been until it was FINALLY trained. So the odds of getting a duplicate of you adult dog is pretty slim, if you think about it.

A website about Cockapoos you might be interested in is http://www.cockapoos.com/generalcont...crgenetics.htm

The CKC (Continental Kennel Club) is a registry that is used by a lot of breeders that have been kicked out of the AKC (American Kennel Club). There was a huge rush to that registry when the AKC started requiring breeders to prove, by DNA samples, that the dogs being registered were really the offspring of the parents being claimed. It's not unusual for a breeder to even breed one breed to another and claim, by registry papers, that the pups are purebred. I've seen this happen frequently with small dogs when the breeder wants to create smaller sizes. For instance, one example was a purebred Bichon Frise bred to a purebred Maltese, to create a smaller Bichon which was then sold with papers claiming the pups were purebred Bichons. This is the kind of thing that the AKC is trying to stop, and the CKC seems to welcome, right along with the pups even claimed to be mixed breed.

I don't have a lot of respect for the AKC, but the CKC is even worse, and unfortunately, all most people know is that they are getting "PAPERS" and so they think that's important. I even know one person who was proud to display the "Pet-a-gree" papers he'd gotten on his pet shop pup.

And finally, please remember the cockapoos, which are really just poodle mixes and cocker mixes, are also dying in the pounds for lack of homes.

squirt1968 · 02-28-2007, 03:28 AM

It seems to me that the same person who said it was not a breed, then comes up with questions about the breed and papers etc. I have known several people who a cockapoo is the only dog they want. You asked for help not criticism. We do not all have to agree. Lets be kind.

Keno's Mom · 02-28-2007, 08:04 AM

First, cockapoos are NOT a breed - there is no consistency. And even if they've been around the longest of the "designer dogs" - they are STILL not a breed and no one is trying to get a standard to apply to AKC for a breed.

Second, CKC (Continental Kennel Club) is a puppy mill and backyard breeder registry - the papers are totally worthless. They don't mean a thing. Just a rip off for the public.

Please do NOT breed your dogs - get them spayed/neutered.

ChRotties · 03-09-2007, 01:36 AM

The CKC (Continental, not Canadian), APRI, and other such registries of this type exist solely because of back yard breeders and puppy mills. The papers are meaningless.

"cockapoos" "flukehounds" or whatever the current "designer mutt" is going by these days, will NEVER gain AKC recognition.
The regulations say, in part, regarding new/rare breeds:

The AKC has a Foundation Stud Service for breeds wanting to be
recognized. One of their statements says:

"The FSS® is not open to "rare" breeds that are a variation of an AKC-
registrable breed or the result of a combination of two AKC-
recognized breeds. This includes and is not limited to differences
such as size (over and under), coat type, coat colors, and coat
colors and/or types that are disqualifications from Conformation
Events by AKC breed standards."

So by that statement, none of the designer mixed breeds would ever be
elegible since those breeders (using the term loosely) are simply
combining 2 already recognized breeds.

It just blows my mind that people continue to breed mixes when the shelters are so full of them already.

I sincerely hope the OP will spay/neuter and just enjoy their dogs.

MagicToller · 03-09-2007, 11:00 AM

It must be interesting to see what kind of pups they will toss.

Quote:

In MY opinion, cockapoos just like other breeds long ago are trying to become an "official" breed.

Hmm.. everyone seems to say this - I have to disagree. Breed development was never a first generation affair. Fanciers throughout history have bred towards purpose and type, and only after many generations of consistent breeding and introduction of new stock and linebreeding, are the dogs considered for acceptance of the breed - and even then it depends on the country of origin and club. What's going on today, is the silliest thing I have ever seen. Marketing dogs based on a "hybrid" factor, and riding the Paris Hilton wave is not what I consider the road to recognition.. and trust me - I've been on this road. It took many lovers, fanciers, and owners of the breed to come together and bring the best of the Duck Toller (my breed) into the rings. The engineers of the breed didn't just slap a retriever and field spaniel together and called it a Retraniel. So much consideration was made for type, working ability, health, and build that the fact that some people consider Cockapoos and Peekapoodles or whatever the hell an attempt of getting recognized is, well. Laughable.