[Shalva]

Ok I have a question.....
I am reading over the health board and there were this afternoon four threads related to.... I bred my dog....and she is pregnant and ......

to be honest I LOVE this forum but I am getting increasingly disgusted with these threads.....

I had two pregnant dogs this summer and never ONCE considered coming to a forum to look for help .......

isn't there something that we can do to address the pregnant dog threads before they even start....

Maybe a sticky saying something like the forum doesn't condone backyard or irresponsible breeding and if you have a breeding or pregnant dog question please contact your vet or mentor for answers..... yadda yadda.... maybe not in these words.... but something along those lines.....

I am just getting increasingly disheartened and to be honest I refuse to help them..... I feel like helping them just click and treats them for being irresponsible and stupid.... I do want to help the dog but in some ways helping them continue to be irresponsible only perpetuates the issue.....

I have totally stopped answering them.... which is all I can do on my end but isn't there some way that this can be addressed as a forum.....

just a thoughts for the night ......

[AkiraleShiba]

I agree with Shalva these threads are sickening I wish moderators would spot them and lock them by saying see your vet.

[ChrissyBz]

I think the mods are pretty good about catching them fairly quick. I don't like it either but if we chase them off, or don't respond at all,won't we also be helping to perpetuate continued "ignorance litters" by refusing to help educate?

One x One? Changes some?

I've learned a LOT since joining last year. Course, I've always been against breeding my own. Too much potential heartbreak for me.

[Shalva]

Originally Posted by ChrissyBz

I think the mods are pretty good about catching them fairly quick. I don't like it either but if we chase them off, or don't respond at all,won't we also be helping to perpetuate continued "ignorance litters" by refusing to help educate?

One x One? Changes some?

I've learned a LOT since joining last year. Course, I've always been against breeding my own. Too much potential heartbreak for me.

I am not talking about the I want to breed my dog threads.....
and while I usually stay out of those.... those are meant to educate... no problem.... I am not even talking about the "my dogs in heat" threads... even those there is room to educate....

I am talking about the threads in the health forum .... the ones where the dog is already pregnant .... and instead of going to their mentors or their vet they are coming here..... I don't see the opportunity to educate other than to make them better backyard breeders.... the damage is already done..... and i would hate to see the health section of the forum become an outlet for irresponsible breeding practices..... just today I counted four threads.... that talked about their already pregnant dogs..... or lactation problems or whatever.....

It just seems to me that its not about educating as it would be in the general forums when someone comes and says should I breed my dog......??? then there is room for education.....

but coming to an internet forum to ask advice after you have already bred your dog and she is pregnant is just ridiculous and that is where I have an issue.
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[xoxluvablexox]

I understand where you are comming from but there's still a chance to educate through those kind of threads too. People that come onto this sight and read those threads see what a irresponsable breeder can go through. As for the OP of those threads besides telling them to go to the vet there is also a chance to educate them about why they should stop breeding their dogs since they're obviously not doing a good job at it.

[Shalva]

Originally Posted by xoxluvablexox

I understand where you are comming from but there's still a chance to educate through those kind of threads too. People that come onto this sight and read those threads see what a irresponsable breeder can go through. As for the OP of those threads besides telling them to go to the vet there is also a chance to educate them about why they should stop breeding their dogs since they're obviously not doing a good job at it.

so should we be helping those people continue to be irresponsible so they can just get better at being irresponsible??
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[xoxluvablexox]

I didn't say that or atleast that's not what I meant. What I meant was that people like that should be educated that what they are doing is wrong and unhealthy for their pets. Some people just don't know what it takes to be a breeder and some don't care but how are you to know the difference. I think it's better to try to educate those people about what is right and wrong when it comes to breeding and hopefully that will lead them to stop breeding there animals or atleast become more educated about breeding and maybe even become good breeders in the future. There are a lot of people out there that just don't have the knowledge about dogs to understand the difference between good and bad breeding practices and people on this forum can help change that.

[ChrissyBz]

Originally Posted by xoxluvablexox

There are a lot of people out there that just don't have the knowledge about dogs to understand the difference between good and bad breeding practices and people on this forum can help change that.

Well said, I'd rather post on a hundred and change one mind than just not make the effort and feel like I didn't even try. Of course I'm also an optimist.

[briteday]

I can always hope that people get tired of answering first time posters with, not only pregnancy, but other emergent health care problems that require a vet.

[ChrissyBz]

Originally Posted by briteday

I can always hope that people get tired of answering first time posters with, not only pregnancy, but other emergent health care problems that require a vet.

Do you mean just not respond? Period? I can do that but I thought it would be better to at least tell them to get a hold of a vet.

[briteday]

I usually make it short and sweet..."Call a vet." No conversation about what it "might be" or they think we have all the answers.

[ChrissyBz]

Ok, that's what I've been doing. Pretty much. I think. I just hate to see members going all spastic on these people and chasing them away before they get a chance to find out in a non-confrontational way how bad most of the people on the forum think BYBing or puppy mills are. At least a short reply might entice them to do a little browsing on their own.

[digits mama]

I think they need to know what they are doing wrong also. So many people just really dont know. The world is a giant place. And getting just a few to look a little further into it may change minds. Even if they are already pregnant. It may keep it from happining again.

[Dakota Spirit]

Originally Posted by digits mama

I think they need to know what they are doing wrong also. So many people just really dont know. The world is a giant place. And getting just a few to look a little further into it may change minds. Even if they are already pregnant. It may keep it from happining again.

That's pretty much my feeling on the matter.

...but then I also question the whole purpose of the Health board...often. We seem to go out of our way to not condone online diagnosis and yet, we have a board basically ASKING people to post their health questions and concerns. Read the description - I'd think it was a safe place to post if I didn't already know to go to the vet's.

Secondly, you may not condone back yard breeding (and trust me, I don't either) but it's not against the law. If it bothers you, then don't post on those topics.

[ChrissyBz]

Originally Posted by Dakota Spirit

That's pretty much my feeling on the matter.

...but then I also question the whole purpose of the Health board...often. We seem to go out of our way to not condone online diagnosis and yet, we have a board basically ASKING people to post their health questions and concerns. Read the description - I'd think it was a safe place to post if I didn't already know to go to the vets.

Secondly, you may not condone back yard breeding (and trust me, I don't either) but it's not against the law. If it bothers you, then don't post on those topics.

But both Curb and RonE have really well worded and clear disclaimers stickyed to the top of the forum and the first time I went on the health forum, that's what I read first. I also sometimes steer people here when they post an obvious go to the vet issue.

Otherwise where would we go with the more minor things, like excessive shedding or dental care etc. questions? + some people are ignorant rather than stupid and feeling comfortable enough to browse instead of being chased off may help to open their eyes in a way direct confrontation could never.

I've gotten a lot of valuable info off the health forum by just browsing previous posts. And who's to say that all those NON members who never join and don't post aren't gleaning knowledge and changing ways of thinking just by reading what we who care enough to answer post. (not implying that not answering means you don't care, don't get your knickers in a knot whoever may be taking umbrage)

ETA: what about kids who want to breed their dogs? or whose parents have a pregnant dog that they care about. Should they not be able to access the benefit of our knowledge and experience. What if we could steer those young malleable minds into getting into dog breeding the RIGHT way? Or put the ideas in their mind of volunteering in a shelter when older?

[Dakota Spirit]

Originally Posted by ChrissyBz

But both Curb and RonE have really well worded and clear disclaimers stickyed to the top of the forum and the first time I went on the health forum, that's what I read first. I also sometimes steer people here when they post an obvious go to the vet issue.

Otherwise where would we go with the more minor things, like excessive shedding or dental care etc. questions? + some people are ignorant rather than stupid and feeling comfortable enough to browse instead of being chased off may help to open their eyes in a way direct confrontation could never.

I've gotten a lot of valuable info off the health forum by just browsing previous posts. And who's to say that all those NON members who never join and don't post aren't gleaning knowledge and changing ways of thinking just by reading what we who care enough to answer post. (not implying that not answering means you don't care, don't get your knickers in a knot whoever may be taking umbrage)

ETA: what about kids who want to breed their dogs? or whose parents have a pregnant dog that they care about. Should they not be able to access the benefit of our knowledge and experience. What if we could steer those young malleable minds into getting into dog breeding the RIGHT way? Or put the ideas in their mind of volunteering in a shelter when older?

I was actually being a bit sarcastic in that statement - I love the health board. I think it offers good information to a lot of people. I do not however, feel it is fair to be ragging on someone for posting questions that appear to be welcomed with open arms (based on the board description).

I've not checked out the Health board stickies as I don't go there often. If I've not read them, I can guarantee a lot of Newbies don't think to do so either.

[ChrissyBz]

Originally Posted by Dakota Spirit

I've not checked out the Health board stickies as I don't go there often. If I've not read them, I can guarantee a lot of Newbies don't think to do so either.

Well now I feel totally ANAL. Sigh, and I used to be such a rule breaker.

[HoundedByHounds]

Just wanted to put this out there...oftentimes, vets know a lot less than you think about dog pregnancy and the actual act of whelping. BREEDERS are usually a much better resource. It's a shame that now we won't be able to even offer those forum links/email list links to people needing help.

IMO saving a puppy or dam is more important to me than the ethics issue...If I have someone with a bitch who isn't eating and is in late stages of pregnancy I would like to be able to give them advice or a mother's pudding recipe. If someone has a question about pregnancy or whelping...I'd like to be able to answer.

That's just me tho.

[RonE]

The problem is not unique to pregnant dogs. It involves dogs who've been throwing up for days or are suffering a partial paralysis or deep wounds or a sudden skin ailment or . . .

People here want to help and even those few who might have some expertise are tempted to offer a diagnosis based on too little information. That puts the dog, and dogforums, at a level of risk that is unacceptable.

That is an administrative decision, not open to debate, and the moderators support it. But I will agree that the health forum description needs serious revamping. People who register on the forum to ask an emergency medical question don't read stickies. They also won't read this. Honestly, they probably won't read the forum description, either, but it should still be redone.

So why IS there a health forum? It is a perfect place for discussions about preventive measures, or personal experience with treatment options for a problem ALREADY DIAGNOSED by a vet, for example.

There are valuable and appropriate discussions happening on the health forum, but diagnosis and home remedies for emergency medical situations are not going to be among them.

[bella's Mum]

this problem should be sorted
mods should closes posts and advise to seek vetinary aid.
not because they are irresponsable
but to prevent someone recieving unqualified advice and acting on it?
surely that is the bigger issue???
am i the only one who thinks this?